Tale of 2 Malos

[porkchopmessiah]

If you haven't yet sulfited the zin, and plan on blending them, why not go ahead and get your blend done and see if the resulting wine will go through MLF with the active bacteria still in the zin?

that had actually occurred, to me, though id only be blending 6 out of 15 gall cab, and the ph post blending was pretty much where I wanted it assuming it didn't complete mlf once blending..but I think bringing ph down in that case easier that bringing up..but point taken....don't really know what I wanna do so the more input from everybody hopefully the better final call...

 

[porkchopmessiah]

Some wines just be stubborn like that. And actually I’ve read BM4x4 is more of a pain historically for mlf. (And merlot).
With all variables the same who knows. My only suggestion would be to run down that entire checklist to help move things along.
1. Temps up. 68° is low for mlf. I sometimes use a heat pad. Gets me around 75° steady.
2. Stir the lees 2x a week
3. Adding some oak helps the bacteria latch onto something and not get buried

I try to keep so2 At crush to a minimum (20ppm ish) or avoid altogether.
Hopefully the tests tonight will give you some clarity

also looking ahead to spring when I try this again, im gonna ditch the sequential and do co inoculation....ifs avoiding so2 at crush do you add ur yeast straight away to supplant any wild yeasts?

 

[Ajmassa]

also looking ahead to spring when I try this again, im gonna ditch the sequential and do co inoculation....ifs avoiding so2 at crush do you add ur yeast straight away to supplant any wild yeasts?

I didn’t add any the first couple years. But still waiting a day because I also added enzymes for extraction. Pickup Saturday morning. Work all day. Enzymes added that afternoon. Yeast added Sunday afternoon.

But last couple grape wines I tested the must and added for a 25-30ppm target. With co-innoc and 100% success rate. Keep in mind I still have no clue what I’m doing. [emoji16]

 

[Johnd]

also looking ahead to spring when I try this again, im gonna ditch the sequential and do co inoculation....ifs avoiding so2 at crush do you add ur yeast straight away to supplant any wild yeasts?

A little different than AJ, I add my enzymes to each fermenter as I crush / destem grapes into them. The must is tested / adjusted as necessary afterwards, then I add my yeast. My must is normally pretty chilly as the grapes come in refrigerated, and it takes a couple of days for the yeast to get rolling, the enzyme is in there doing its thing the whole time. If my fruit is good, I don't add any SO2 to the must, and pitch my MLB / nutrients as soon as AF gets going.

 

[Ajmassa]

A little different than AJ, I add my enzymes to each fermenter as I crush / destem grapes into them. The must is tested / adjusted as necessary afterwards, then I add my yeast. My must is normally pretty chilly as the grapes come in refrigerated, and it takes a couple of days for the yeast to get rolling, the enzyme is in there doing its thing the whole time. If my fruit is good, I don't add any SO2 to the must, and pitch my MLB / nutrients as soon as AF gets going.

Looking back I’ve only added so2 to must once. I do remember existing l levels much lower then expected (Chilean). The so2 threw me off my game with timing. Since it states so2 weakens enzymes and needs to be spaced out ‘x’ hours. Really didn’t have good reasoning. Still finding my way

Routine’s been crush - enzyme- then yeast next night or whenever temps creeped up high enough. Maybe I read too much. Because that thought of “well everyone else does it. You should too” never fully goes away. In spite of not encountering issues and even successfully running an all-natural ferment. Which took noticeably longer to start compared to cultured yeast.

 

[mbleill]

I routinely tape rubber seed starting mats to the sides of my carboys and tanks. The mats stay a constant 80 deg F and will warm up the wine in the containers to about 75 deg F and kicks off MLF relative quickly. The ambient temperature in my winery is about 62 to 65 deg F.

AMAZON Link: https://www.amazon.com/Ohuhu-Seedli...ords=seed+starting+mats&qid=1574359741&sr=8-6

 

[Mario Dinis]

I did lay low for the most part. Though when everything became available my old man asked me to go with him to pick up his juice, which is tradition. Our local spot in south Philly always has the previous year’s wine tapped from the barrel, along with all the Italian meats/cheeses and bread. And ya just shoot the breeze with other winemakers while picking up and perusing the equipment.
Hard to walk out empty handed. I grabbed a couple juice buckets on a whim- (a cab and a barbera) because, well why not? (And the reason I went sequential ml) Those buckets can make some decent vino and age well. Unfortunately I just couldn’t commit to the typical “life gets put on pause- large grape batch” this year.

*it was a decision we discussed and agreed upon together. And when I got home that day with juice she says “I totally was expecting to see a truck full of grapes to be honest.”
Lol. Nope. I was a good boy

@Ajmassa , could you share that spot in South Philly for future reference? I'd like to check it out.

 

[Ajmassa]

@Ajmassa , could you share that spot in South Philly for future reference? I'd like to check it out.

Sure. It’s called Procacci Bros. They are a produce distributor selling seasonal wine grapes since the 40’s! Every harvest they turn the warehouse into a winemaking depot with grapes, juice, equipment etc. Its down in the industrial area by the stadiums. Very old school joint.
There’s also Gino Pintos in south Jersey with much more options from different areas. They also do spring harvest juice & grapes beginning around April.
Btw- don’t mention one to the other. It’s a feud straight from a Scorsese movie!

https://m.facebook.com/procacciwinegrapes/

 

[Mario Dinis]

Sure. It’s called Procacci Bros. They are a produce distributor selling seasonal wine grapes since the 40’s! Every harvest they turn the warehouse into a winemaking depot with grapes, juice, equipment etc. Its down in the industrial area by the stadiums. Very old school joint.
There’s also Gino Pintos in south Jersey with much more options from different areas. They also do spring harvest juice & grapes beginning around April.
Btw- don’t mention one to the other. It’s a feud straight from a Scorsese movie!

https://m.facebook.com/procacciwinegrapes/
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Thanks, LOL, I promise I won't mention. Looks like a good place. Have to take a trip there. @AdegaAguiar , we have to check this place out. It's in South Philly.

 

[Ajmassa]

Thanks, LOL, I promise I won't mention. Looks like a good place. Have to take a trip there. @AdegaAguiar , we have to check this place out. It's in South Philly.

Who’s your current supplier? Is it Corrados?

I purchased Corrados grapes for the first time last year for my throwback “family red” blend. Very cool shop. Loads of equipment. And no complaints about the grapes. Right on par with Procacci. OP @porkchopmessiah gets his stuff from there too.

 

[Mario Dinis]

Who’s your current supplier? Is it Corrados?

I purchased Corrados grapes for the first time last year for my throwback “family red” blend. Very cool shop. Loads of equipment. And no complaints about the grapes. Right on par with Procacci. OP @porkchopmessiah gets his stuff from there too.

I started with them, Corrado's, but these past two years I've been buying my buckets of juice at Europa Pombalense in Elizabeth. So far so good.

 

[Ajmassa]

I started with them, Corrado's, but these past two years I've been buying my buckets of juice at Europa Pombalense in Elizabeth. So far so good.

Quick google search seems that Europa sells the same juice and grapes as Procacci. Regina juice and Regina & Pia grapes. Or maybe even get it from Procacci. I know all these places like Procacci, Corrados, and pintos redistribute to local shops in the area.

 

[Mario Dinis]

Quick google search seems that Europa sells the same juice and grapes as Procacci. Regina juice and Regina & Pia grapes. Or maybe even get it from Procacci. I know all these places like Procacci, Corrados, and pintos redistribute to local shops in the area.

Yes, Regina is what I have bought at Europa Pombalense. So far I'm pleased with it.

 

[porkchopmessiah]

I'll be heading down to Pintos in the spring for sure....If anybody else is, perhaps a meetup is in order..

I tried to rack all my cab and zin, having given up on malo in the cab
I wound up blending 6 gall of cab with 9 zin, and keeping about 3 gal zin and 8 gallon of cab unblended.

I just had hernia surgery so needless to say racking was harder (had to wait til wife went to work)....wound up using vac pump to pull on empty demijohns with 2 ported bung...it was slow as hell but it got the job done

 

[Ajmassa]

I'll be heading down to Pintos in the spring for sure....If anybody else is, perhaps a meetup is in order..

I tried to rack all my cab and zin, having given up on malo in the cab
I wound up blending 6 gall of cab with 9 zin, and keeping about 3 gal zin and 8 gallon of cab unblended.

I just had hernia surgery so needless to say racking was harder (had to wait til wife went to work)....wound up using vac pump to pull on empty demijohns with 2 ported bung...it was slow as hell but it got the job done

Ah that’s a bummer to hear about the surgery.
Hope ya feel better and heal up quickly.
Not understanding the pump explanation btw. How is what you explained different than your typical setup?
For the cab I’d have done the same thing too. Can only fight so long unprotected before starts becoming a liability. A little age can still work wonders regardless of the malo imo.
As far as the Pintos meetup goes— that can be tricky. Pickup day is a long day for me as a one man band. But if timing worked out would be cool. Maybe a coffee or quick bite to eat at a nearby diner, exchange some bottles then hit up Pintos. Definitely prefer beforehand so my grapes aren’t cookin in the back of the truck.

 

[porkchopmessiah]

Lol...breakfast would probably be better, last time I left here at like 6am to get there by 8....but I'm prob gonna get blueberry bushes down there more toward the summer so I'll be passing thru the area again....but either way is a long way off

 

[Ajmassa]

Lol...breakfast would probably be better, last time I left here at like 6am to get there by 8....but I'm prob gonna get blueberry bushes down there more toward the summer so I'll be passing thru the area again....but either way is a long way off

Well if your gonna get em anywhere might as well be there. After all, it is the bluberry capital of the world!