Want to make my own wine, husband skeptical. Help me convince him!

[Zintrigue]

So I'm browsing winemaking kits on amazon (completely overwhelmed, by the way) and getting excited about this whole idea when hubs pipes up and says it doesn't sound worth it. He thinks that all of the time and costly ingredients it takes to make wine is ridiculous when I can just go buy a $7 bottle of Barefoot from the store and be done.

I want to make my own, though. I want to play with tannins and acids and subtle flavors of berry and cocoa and the gamut. So here's what I'll need to argue my case!

How many bottles of wine do I get out of 6 gallons of wine from a kit? I see these "kits" on amazon for $40-100, but don't know what they entail. Just juice and additives?

Would it be better for me to buy the juice concentrate ($20, roughly) and the additives separately?

How long does it take, roughly, from start to corking? I guess I mean how long until I can start a new batch? This will probably vary, I know.

Personally, I think it's worth my time for the hobby aspect, but the only way I'm going to convince that thar husband thing is if I basically give him a cost per bottle on my end. I realize this figure could vary greatly depending on quality of product. I need to convince him that he'll benefit, too.

Any other good points to bring to the debate table?

And lastly. Amazon is full of starter kits, but from the reviews they all seem to be missing "instructions," or some kind of power backflip hose-a-mabob thing. Can anyone give me an amazon link to a good starter kit they recommend? It would save me a lot of trouble and ensure that I'm making a good purchase.

I realize that the initial startup cost of this hobby is going to make a bit of a dent in my bank account. I'm betting it's nothing compared to my gardening hobby this year, though. ::

Thanks, everyone!

 

[vacuumpumpman]

If interested I would enjoy talking to you over the phone - as you have alot of questions to answer - please PM me if interested

6 gallons = 30 - 750 ml of wine bottles

I would suggest making a batch of dragons blood at first, to get your feet wet per say

take a look at craigslist for those winemaking deals

minimum of 3 months prior to bottling

remember time is always on your side and ask questions

 

[montanaWineGuy]

He is wrong. The most expensive ingredient of my wine making is the sugar. Today I bought 2 ten pound bags of sugar at $6 each. And each will make almost 30 bottles. That's 20c a bottle. All the other ingredients are pennies per bottle. The next most expensive aspect is the corks, they can be reused...

 

[montanaWineGuy]

One more thing. Skip the kits. Pick your own fruit, add sugar, toss in some yeast, etc.

 

[Mismost]

I don't where you are located, but I suggest you check out Craigslist for equipment...buckets, hoses, spoons, airlocks. People come and go in the sport! I bought almost all my gear used for pennies on the dollar off of Craigslist or the Classifieds on this site. i have made grape and apple from frozen juice...plum, banana, and prickly pear from fresh fruit....and a bunch of kits. At this point in time, I like the kits...they are just as fast as the frozen juices and better.

Six gallons batch, they say you'll get 30 bottles....I never do, I average around 24 to 26 bottles.

Now convincing your husband, good luck....I'm still working on wife!! BUT....you can make wine. To me it's like cooking in slow motion and the yeast does most of the work. Read the recipe, follow directions, sanitize and you'll be just fine. Go to Kit Wines on this site and read "Tweaking Cheap Kits"...long thread....take notes...you'll learn a lot. search for the famous Dragon Blood, folks seem to love it....I still haven't made a batch of that yet.

go for it...if it isn't for you, sell your gear on Craigslist! Warning, if you do like this hobby, it can take over a piece of your life and most of your (in my case) office space.

 

[vernsgal]

Hi Zintrigue.Your post hit home with me. My hubby also said it would be easier to buy a bottle of wine rather than to go through all the trouble to make it.As I pointed out to him, a hobby is something for you to do that you enjoy and it helps you to relax. It's the same as the saying "why buy a puzzle when you can just purchase the picture". Also as you said, you would like to make a wine that suits your taste.
Here's my suggestions for your queries
1/a 6 gal. kit usually gives you 27-30 bottles and come with all additives needed
2/ I suggest getting the full kit rather than the juice only because it's easiest the "1st time" to have everything supplied for you.
3/ be prepared to give this time. I think that is what many do wrong in the beginning.I'm not saying you have to wait years- but certainly months.Most kits are 28-40 day kits-which mean from start to bottling. Where a lot of starters get it wrong is they think that's the time it takes for it to be done.Wrong.That's the same as looking in a recipe book and going by the prep time not counting the bake/cooking time. It will need shelf time.I suggest when making the kit for your 1st time to follow instructions up to when it says to bottle.Instead of bottling, rack it back into clean carboy with a bit of k-meta and let it sit 3 months, then bottle and let it sit another 2-3 months.Now try a bottle and as time goes by while drinking these you will notice the change in taste,mouthfeel etc.That is how you will find the "aging" of your wines and the effects.
I don't think anyone can really say what kit is good for you and hubby without knowing your tastes in wines. Even then, the best would be for you to go through Amazon (if you don't have a local you brew/wine supply store near by) and post a few kits that sound like you would enjoy, and people here can then say if they've tried ,opinions on quality etc.
As suggested by others, see if you can find carboy, fermenting pail etc on Craigs list.If you want a list of bare necessities let me know.
Finally, I would also not suggest tweeking a kit with anything,ie tannins,berries etc. until you've made it the 1st time and know what needs changing.I tweek every kit I make .Sometimes with a few items ,sometimes with just a little added tannin.Mistakes I have made in past was adding things before knowing what the final product would taste like.
Tell hubby,Initial purchase will cost you anywhere from $5-7 a bottle(I'm not sure where you live)but afterward it'll be 3-5. Of course say that with tongue in cheek because once this addiction hits you'll always want more carboys,a pump, a room...

 

[dralarms]

Your wine will most likely be a whole lot better than store bought also.

Unlike montanaguy I don't reuse corks, at .10 each it's not worth it.

 

[Julie]

I do not advise re-using corks. And like vernsgal said, it is a hobby. Welcome to winemakingtalk. Good Luck!

 

[richmke]

What major city do you live near? There might be a help-you-brew wine shop that sells kit wine by the bottle. Then your husband can taste the difference between a $7 bottle of Barefoot wine, and what you can make with a kit.

In another post, you said you have a 4 liter demijohn. Maybe try a 1 gallon kit first. You will need to buy a 7.5 gallon or larger pail for your primary.

1 gallon kits
http://labelpeelers.com/world-vineyard-1-gallon-kits/

I'd recommend a 1 gallon batch of Skeeter Pee if you want to go that route. The lemon wine would be great for the summer. Although it does smooth out with more time in the bottle.

Would it be better for me to buy the juice concentrate ($20, roughly) and the additives separately?

No. Either buy a kit, a juice bucket of wine grapes, or fresh wine grapes. Random grape juice will not impress your husband. You want justification for pursuing the hobby. Making mediocre wine (which is fine if you are on a budget) will not do that. You want to make a $15 bottle of wine for $7. Not a $5 bottle of wine for $1.

How long does it take, roughly, from start to corking? I guess I mean how long until I can start a new batch?

You can bottle as soon as 2 months. However, the more carboys you have, the more you can have going at the same time. With 1 primary fermentor, you can start a batch and have it into a carboy in about a week. At that point, you can start another batch.

How long you keep it in carboys is your decision. I like to age my wine in the carboy, so I have about 9 of them. If you can keep the wine in a carboy for 9+ months, then you can skip the degassing and clearing agents (bentonite, superklear, etc.). The wine will degass and clear on its own during that time (except for pectin haze, which you might need pectic enzyme if you don't have a kit).

 

[richmke]

I found one of your posts, and you are 1 hour away from Modesto, CA

Ok gang: Where can she pick up a bucket of juice near Modesto? Anyone live near Modesto and can share a bottle of wine for Zintrigue to impress her husband?

A bucket of Chilean juice will cost you about $60, and it comes with a free bucket you can ferment in. Although, if there is not enough headspace, after it is has started fermenting, you might want to move 3 liters to the deminjohn you have.

This is an interesting event that was near you (September, 2015). $200 for 24 bottles of Cabernet. $9/bottle for something that is likely to be better than the $7 Barefoot Wine. Then you have the equipment to do it the next year for $100 ($5/bottle).

BIG CRUSH: Make Your Own Wine at Home! 9/13/15
Barley & Wine
Modesto, CA

Option 1: Grapes, yeast & additives (if you have your own primary fermenter & carboy) $99.99 + $6.49 fee

Option 2: Includes primary fermenter, bottles & cork (if you have your own carboy) $149.99 + $9.24 fee

Option 3: Includes all necessary equipment $199.99 + $11.99 fee

Event Details

Make your own wine at Barley & Wine's Big Crush. Join us for our 1st Annual Big Crush, the first event of it's kind in the Central Valley. Admission gets you locally grown Wine Grapes, the use of professional grade equipment & personal training to ensure that your personal vintage is of the higest quality.

Sign up for the hour time slot that works the best for you. Please note that grapes will be crushed at our facility, but the wine will be made in your home, so you will need to transport it home. Crushing & pressing can get messy, we suggest you dress accordingly. On Crush Day, you will schedule a second date to come back and press the grape skins.

Each admission will be good for two people, and you'll end up making two cases of wine (Cabernet). We sincerely hope you join us for this once in a lifetime expierence. Please contact us with any questions at (209) 523-2739, or by clicking the contact organizer button.

http://www.eventbrite.com/e/big-crush-make-your-own-wine-at-home-91315-tickets-18075925580

 

[bkisel]

The biggest benefit, joy actually, that I get from my wine making hobby is gifting bottles of wine to family and friends. If it weren't for that joy and several other aspects, e.g. creativity, that one gets from this and similar hobbies then I would have to agree with your husband - it wouldn't be worth it.

Personally I'd start with a 10L kit of a variety of wine you and your husband like or Dragon's Blood as mentioned above.

 

[DoctorCAD]

I'm going to go against everyone else's responses and say without a doubt that you can easily buy a bottle of wine for less than it will cost you to make it. Heck, you can get a fair bottle of wine that was made in Australia and shipped all the way around the world, trucked to the store and held in inventory and sat on a shelf for less than the cost of a new empty bottle almost. I don't know how they do it and make money!!!

That said, do you go to the store to buy chocolate chip cookies? Sure, but aren't your homemade ones a lot better? A fast-food hamburger is pretty good, but making your own ground meat and spices, forming the patty just the way you like it and grilling it to perfection is WAAAAAAY better. Potato salad from Boston Market is OK, but nothing beats my grandmothers recipe.

So, its really hard to put a dollar amount on "your" wine vs. Barefoot. You just cant quantify some things. My wife loves the Barefoot wines, me, I wouldn't use them to rinse out my waste buckets.

Also, I will strongly recommend a wine kit not grapes or pure juice to start. (Oh, and not an Amazon kit, get a Wine Expert or a RJS) You will get a predictable and pretty good wine from the well known kit makers and will actually learn the processes by following the directions on your first couple of kits.

Its a nice romantic vision that you have about " I want to play with tannins and acids and subtle flavors of berry and cocoa and the gamut " however, you need to realize that the time from playing to actually tasting can be a year or more, sticking with proven recipes and very subtle tweaks is really the best way to go.

Or you could just wing it and maybe be the next Robert Mondavi. The point is that you want to try. Its a life-long hobby.

 

[AZMDTed]

Almost all hobbies cost money (some more than others) with little or no chance of actually making or saving money as a result. I think trying to justify wine making in terms of dollars spent versus dollars saved misses the point a little bit. As you mentioned, hobbies are designed to give you enjoyment, satisfaction, well-being. That should be enough justification. However, there is an 'entry fee' for wine that is significant. You need to buy the equipment, about $125, bottles and corks, and then recurring costs for the kits themselves.

Wine as a hobby is in that small class where you can actually avoid costs later as a result of it. So you can make a case based on money, but as was also said, the joy here doesn't come to all of us in dollars saved, but rather being able to say to family and friends, as well as yourself, I Made This! Whether it's wood working, quilting, painting, photography to most of us the real joy comes in the happiness of creating something we're proud of. And to some degree we control the outcome and make it our own.

I haven't made Dragon's Blood so I can't and won't comment on it as a place to start. I also don't know your tastes and financial situation so take this with a big grain of salt. My advice is that if you need to convince your husband beyond the quality of life improvement from having a hobby, then you need to attack it both from a numbers game and a quality game. The time you spend is going to be roughly the same whether it's an inexpensive kit or an expensive one, but the quality of wine will be vastly different. I would start with the best kit I could afford purchased from a company like labelpeelers.com. That way when he takes his first sip he will know how good it can be and maybe see the potential value in quality. If it's a cheaper kit that's of comparable quality to $7 wine then you've only got a cost comparison argument to make.

The equipment will be spread out over all the kits you make. Bottles will be reused. Kit costs range from about $1.50 a bottle to under $5 a bottle. So actual savings won't be that great but at $5 a bottle top end kits, your wine quality will be far superior to the store $7 bottle.

I make the wine in my house, but my wife does all the corking, labeling and shrink wrapping. In the end, she's the one who turns it from a big bottle of red juice into a pretty bottle of wine, so she has taken ownership of it too. And there's nothing like having ownership in something to making one feel their pride and satisfaction, and desire to keep making more.

Lots of rambling, I know. But I hope he will understand the hobby value which should be enough. Then go for quality and cost. Good luck. Have fun.

 

[TonyR]

Check to see if there is a wine making club in your area, check wine making supply stores they would know about clubs. Go to a meeting and find someone who makes the type of wine you like and taste it, talk to the members, you may also find some good deals on equipment needed. And you will get more help than you need

 

[richmke]

I need to convince him that he'll benefit, too.

I'm sure there are non-wine ways you can show him that he will benefit

 

[JDesCotes]

Make sure to lookup "skeeterpee". It's a very inexpensive lemon wine. If you buy your materials in bulk you can get the cost per 750ml bottle down to as low as 14c each!

Also, the sugar and lemon juice can be purchased at Costco for super cheap!

 

[Floandgary]

Aside from, and in addition to all the fun this hobby can provide ,,, The knowledge you will accumulate can all be found here ,,,, AND IT"S FREE . So when you just happen to find it necessary to purchase one of those impressive sounding/looking labels at the wine/spirits store, you'll at least have some idea what you're looking at! Once you get past the basics and understand the process, you'll find that there is actually very little work involved as the wine can make itself. Just ask anyone here who's spent time counting bubbles in an airlock Welcome and good luck

 

[Kraffty]

As you can see there are an assortment of views here and ALL work, you'll just have to settle into one that works for you. My suggestion would be to buy an equipment kit at $99.00. It'll give you all the physical stuff you need to make that first batch. At the same time buy a low/med wine kit like the Vintners Reserve at about $80.00. It includes all the ingredients you need. The only thing you'll have to provide is about 30 empty clean bottles and you'll have at least 3 months time to drink and then save those. Total investment under 200.00 including taxes, divided by 30 bottles is under 7.00 per bottle BUT next kit at 80.00 will work out to under 3.00 per bottle since you're now equipped.

There are really good vendors here on the site and I'd suggest exploring their websites. They provide so much more info, especially for a beginner, than amazon or eBay. I'd also visit morewinemaking.com because they have a central california warehouse that both speeds delivery and saves expenses for us californians.

Lastly I'd suggest getting a white wine kit to start as they're ready to drink so much earlier than reds. Popping the cork on your very own first bottle is really a unique and gratifying experience. Welcome the the Addiction!
Mike

 

[Zintrigue]

Wow, you guys are a wealth of information. Thank you!

Yes, I did end up making my welchs grape juice wine a few months back with bread yeast and a balloon. It was a fascinating experience. The wine came out kind of a bricky blush with a very high alcohol content. Flavor wasn't so bad now that I've had it sit in bottles for six months, it's mellowed into that welchy sort of flavor we all appreciate in grape juice.

Far from being a wine I'd want to present to my family and friends, I'm still over the moon about this silly little accomplishment of mine! And I use it for red cooking wine, haha

So that said, the dragons blood looks fun to make and I definitely want to try that. I agree with everyone on the "joy of the hobby" aspect and ideally would like to get hubby involved as well. I know that playing with flavors takes a long time, I have a log book set aside so that I can write down each process and improve upon it slowly. I like to make the original recipes first and go from there. Same thing in cooking, right?

The cheap wine kits thread was emailed to me from this site, and that's what got me all fired up again. Haha

Yes, I'm an hour from Modesto. An hour and a half if I want to drive into the city. Go figure I missed that event. Hope they have it again this year.

Gosh there were so many good responses I can't remember them all. Going to have to go back and read again. A lot of you had great advice, I'm quite appreciative of it. Especially rich's advice about convincing hubs. Too bad the man is on to my tricks!

 

[jgmann67]

Wow, you guys are a wealth of information. Thank you!

Yes, I did end up making my welchs grape juice wine a few months back with bread yeast and a balloon. It was a fascinating experience. The wine came out kind of a bricky blush with a very high alcohol content. Flavor wasn't so bad now that I've had it sit in bottles for six months, it's mellowed into that welchy sort of flavor we all appreciate in grape juice.

Far from being a wine I'd want to present to my family and friends, I'm still over the moon about this silly little accomplishment of mine! And I use it for red cooking wine, haha

So that said, the dragons blood looks fun to make and I definitely want to try that. I agree with everyone on the "joy of the hobby" aspect and ideally would like to get hubby involved as well. I know that playing with flavors takes a long time, I have a log book set aside so that I can write down each process and improve upon it slowly. I like to make the original recipes first and go from there. Same thing in cooking, right?

The cheap wine kits thread was emailed to me from this site, and that's what got me all fired up again. Haha

Yes, I'm an hour from Modesto. An hour and a half if I want to drive into the city. Go figure I missed that event. Hope they have it again this year.

Gosh there were so many good responses I can't remember them all. Going to have to go back and read again. A lot of you had great advice, I'm quite appreciative of it. Especially rich's advice about convincing hubs. Too bad the man is on to my tricks!

I had this same issue with my wife when I first started making wine (only about a year and a half ago). She was skeptical about the quality and thought the expense was too much. But, less than $400 you can get all the equipment you need and a good quality kit, too (maybe two).

I disagree with those who suggest wading out into the world of wine from grapes. To me, it's like going on an unguided tour of Italy without being able to speak the language. Wine making is best as an evolution of sorts (IMO). Try a kit or two and see how you like it before you take on the entire process from scratch.

White wines will mature quicker than red wines (regardless of the quality of the kit). But, the greatest lesson winemaking teaches is patience. Make wine that you like to drink, not just wine that you can make quickly and hope that you will like it.

If he's drinking Barefoot, it's not going to be that difficult to blow his socks off with wine you make on your own. The commercial wines typically have a ton of sulfites in them (headache in a bottle). Your wine will have 1/4 of the sulfites or less.

When I finally let my wife taste what I was making, her reaction was "wow, this is really good." Now, she's more interested in tapping into the supply of wine in our basement than going to the state store to buy commercial stuff.

For a red, I'd recommend your first kit be one with grape skins in it. The WE World Vineyard Washington Merlot with skins is a great entry level red that will give you a nice finished product fairly quickly (about 3-6 months). Not bad for a $60 kit. For a white, the WE Luna Bianca is a little more pricey but is exceptionally good.

Things that will ruin your experience:

* lack of patience.
* lack of proper sanitation.
* failing to follow directions.
* failing to properly de-gas your wine before clearing or bottling.

There are ways to save money while making wine, too:

* recycling old wine bottles - takes time, but saves some money ($15 a case). I struck a deal with friends that a case of empty, clean wine bottles will get them a bottle of their choice from my basement. Also, I know a guy who owns a restaurant... again, it's more work than money.

* borrow a floor corker to do your first batch. They're $70-100 new and very well worth the expense if you're going to stay in the hobby. Hand corkers are difficult to master (tell you what, if you want mine, I'll sell it to you for half what you can get a new one for - never used).