when good wines gone bad

[geek]

Joe,

so it looks like once you get the 2nd fermentation over you rack the wine removing the sediment and raisins, and then it looks like you bottle right there after adding the chems?

You rather bottle that early and not leave in carboy aging for a little bit?

..

 

[joeswine]

Game plan

WE still need to degas this wine and believe you me there's a lot to degas, not this Thursday but next we will re-rack and let it settle out before resuming work on this AMARONE, we have a lot of time left on the schedule and there's no rush, it's a long ways from finish.

 

[TomK-B]

Joe, I've noticed that with this kit and with the Sangiovese kit you do not snap down a lid with airlock on your primary fermenter. You simply cover with a towel to keep things from falling into the wine from the environment. Others say the primary should be made air-tight, especially after the fermentation is half way finished. Why do you simply cover with a towel?

 

[geek]

Joe, I've noticed that with this kit and with the Sangiovese kit you do not snap down a lid with airlock on your primary fermenter. You simply cover with a towel to keep things from falling into the wine from the environment. Others say the primary should be made air-tight, especially after the fermentation is half way finished. Why do you simply cover with a towel?

You should never air-tight in primary as the yeast really needs oxygen to do its job. Once fermentation is over then you air-lock it.

 

[joeswine]

my towel

yes, the more surface area the greater the oxygen contact with the wine the better the overall fermentation and sometimes much quicker....just my preference..........also not to allow the flies not to take a swim ............my way. there is still along ways to go before it's ready for bottling..................

 

[joeswine]

amarone moving forward

• Corking machine (there are various types, we use an italian floor corker.)

The Process:

As always, sanitize anything that comes in contact with thewine. Including yourself. J

Add half gallon of warm water to the primary fermenting bucket withthe bentonite packet and stir until dissolved.

Add the large juice package. (Be careful, it’s heavy!) Rinse this outwith a little bit of spring water to make sure you get it all.

Next, we added the smaller “grape skin packet”. It’s lumpy so you alsowant to rinse the bag out w/ water also, to get all the grape skins.

Now, we take the SG reading. We’re at 1.10.

Next, we added the smaller “grape skin packet”. It’s lumpy so you alsowant to rinse the bag out w/ water also, to get all the grape skins.

Now, here comes all that Hungarian oak! We are adding 3 packets ofHungarian powdered oak (wow!).

Here comes the fun part. YEAST! 2 packets of RC-212 yeast. Cover witha towel and wait 5-7 days, gently punching down the grape skins.

SecondaryFermentation:

Now that we fermented dry (SG reading is 1.010), now it’stime to rack it.

Notice the grape skins on top? This is the cap that formedfrom the grape skin packet that was provided in the Winexpert Amarone Kit,along with the addition of California Raisins (that I added to add more body).

We racked this down to a carboy but it is pretty gassy. I’mgoing to let this settle out for a few days and degas some on its own. Over theweekend, I will force-gas it (If I have to) by giving it a good old-fashionedstir. Once I feel that it’s de-gassed enough, I will stabilize it with thepotassium sorbet packet, K-Met Packet, and packet of Chitosan (clearingagent).

Now we wait. Stay tuned.

 

[roger80465]

Hey Joe (or any of the other 'tweakers' out there),
I have started an Em Premeur Amarone and have added the grape skins to primary per instructions. I plan to move to secondary with the raisins later next week. I am a little concerned about the raisin addition since I will be leaving on vacation on 9/21. Is there a problem leaving the raisins in secondary for 3 weeks or should I pull them after a week? I have reread the Sangiovese thread and can't get a handle on how long the raisins stayed in the secondary. It looks like it was several weeks but I wanted to be sure. Thanks for your input on this.

 

[geek]

I think the raisins should be left for as long as the 2nd fermentation goes on, a month at the most.

 

[sdelli]

Roger,

The raisins can be left in the secondary for 3 or 4 weeks no problem.... But on this kit Joe put them in the primary instead.... Here is a quote from one of the previous pages of this thread.....

This kit was still started on August 22 it is August 27 five days later we reached the capitalization point this will boost the alcohol level that will give the amarone it's high abv.characteristics ,were also going to do at this point because I'm causing a second fermentation, I'm going to add the Sun maid raisins at this point to my open bucket ,these is a a 2 pound bag but I'm only going to add half of one of the bags ,this along with the capitalization should prove to be enough to add a depth note to the sauce ,at that point we will have to watch the specific gravity really close, its going to start not only a second fermentation but rehydrate the raisins also this is the tricky part if you haven't done this before, maybe you shouldn't stay on the course as per the manufacturer, or follow me closely when this one is done if those out there thought the sangiovese was decent ,this wine will be exceptional... I assure you. At this point we bump up the SG 1.020 just enough to put us over the edge along with the raisins and their chemistry adding sugars to the wine. Starting to look good.................. stay tuned

 

[roger80465]

Thanks for the replies. The recap from Joe's Amarone is helpful. My kit came with both dried winery grape skins and raisins but there is no mention of the raisins in the instructions. So I planned to add to secondary when it reaches around 1.020 - 1.010 range. I just wanted to be sure a long soak would not harm the wine. Guess I will continue on the planned path. Thanks again

 

[Enologo]

Joe, I noticed in the photos that you remove the re-hydrated raisins with a strainer. Do you press out the juice after you remove them or while they're still in the bucket??

 

[Boatboy24]

Thanks for the replies. The recap from Joe's Amarone is helpful. My kit came with both dried winery grape skins and raisins but there is no mention of the raisins in the instructions. So I planned to add to secondary when it reaches around 1.020 - 1.010 range. I just wanted to be sure a long soak would not harm the wine. Guess I will continue on the planned path. Thanks again

Roger,

I just moved my EP Amarone into the barrel about a week ago. I fermented exactly as you plan. Skins in primary, raisins in secondary. I had them in there for about 4 weeks total - no issues.

 

[roger80465]

Roger,

I just moved my EP Amarone into the barrel about a week ago. I fermented exactly as you plan. Skins in primary, raisins in secondary. I had them in there for about 4 weeks total - no issues.

Thanks, Boat. Looks like I will have no worries on this. I will carry on as planned.

 

[LoneStarLori]

Joe, I noticed in the photos that you remove the re-hydrated raisins with a strainer. Do you press out the juice after you remove them or while they're still in the bucket??

No, you just strain them out. If you press them, you will get pulp and you don't want that.

 

[joeswine]

Raising removal

Good morning, the reason I removed the reasons with a strainer is because it's just simpler at that point,if they were in a bottle or glass carboy that makes it a little more difficult, you would do it at the next racking, because I haven it in a open vessel it made life so much easier ,and 0 By the Way I don't squeeze all the juice out of the raisins the reason for that is the raisins have given up to the wine all they could give, I don't want to make the wine a more bitter than it will be. There is no other reason, and there's no need to do it , make sense? E

 

[Thig]

Joe, I noticed in the photos that you remove the re-hydrated raisins with a strainer. Do you press out the juice after you remove them or while they're still in the bucket??

Maybe it all depends. The instructions for my La Bodega port kit says to put them into a strainer bag and squeeze them.

 

[joeswine]

Raisins squeeze or not to squeeze?

I guess you're right it all depends , this is my way of doing it and believe me the raisin have given up all they can give, then all you have left is a very bitter fruit the goal is to extract the best of the raisins sugars and essence without overpowering the baseline ,at least that's my approach follow the instructions, that's another approach. H

 

[TomK-B]

follow the instructions, that's another approach. H

Instructions? What instructions? We don't need no stinkin' instructions!

 

[joeswine]

Instructions

Instructions are there for a reason but if you been doing kits for as long as I have in making wine as long as I have it all becomes the same instruction and let's face it after you have completed your first five or 10 you can almost memorize what the next step is if we have good sanitation skills and all the tools in your toolbox to move forward at any time then the instructions just become a reference for the kit master to identify what SG should be at what time and what position the rest is all basic but we have to stick to basics because we have a lot of newbies here, and then sometimes I drift away and do my own thing .that's the fun of winemaking and when it stops being fun I will stop.

 

[bkisel]

Bought a RJS VdV Pino Noir kit this afternoon and was wondering if this particular kit would be a good candidate for trying the raisin tweak showcased earlier in this thread, what do you think?

Thanks...