when good wines gone bad

[Ricky]

Last two photos of this kit:

Joe, you had to top off a 3 gallon kit?... With spring water... I hope I don't have to top off my black forest kits....

 

[joeswine]

Topping off

Yes I did, the volume of the baseline did not equate to 3 gallons it was about 1 quart shy that's why the addition of the water the concentrate that were using and the added dimension of the water should have no effect, but I'm right where the manufacturer specs say I should be, I took a look at it this afternoon around 230 and it has a beautiful crown of yeast bubbling away.

You always have to be aware that the manufacturer specs are just that and what you get out of the package may not quite be filling the specs and that's why we learn as winemakers to Think outside the Box................. thanks for following

 

[TomK-B]

I had the same experience with my RJS Black Forest Port kit. But I decided not to top up until after I'd added the f-pack. I was thinking that the manufacturer had reduced the amount of the grape juice by the amount of the f-pack. And it wasn't too far off. I still had to top up with about a half bottle of brandy when I moved it for stabilization.

 

[vernsgal]

Yes I did, the volume of the baseline did not equate to 3 gallons it was about 1 quart shy that's why the addition of the water the concentrate that were using and the added dimension of the water should have no effect, but I'm right where the manufacturer specs say I should be, I took a look at it this afternoon around 230 and it has a beautiful crown of yeast bubbling away.

You always have to be aware that the manufacturer specs are just that and what you get out of the package may not quite be filling the specs and that's why we learn as winemakers to Think outside the Box................. thanks for following

So Joe, you think it would be all right to top off with a bit of water in this case? I"m down a little over a quart (I think).

 

[joeswine]

Topping off

Yes I do and the reason being is that it is such a little bit of water to add to the concentrate it shouldn't have any effect, but I do not recommend adding F pack that is totally not what the fpac is for, that is strictly for flavor and nothing more when adding it to the base , in my opinion and my opinion only as well as the manufacturers is incorrect you are wasting your flavor, in my oppion.

 

[vernsgal]

Thanks Joe. And I agree with not using your f-pak to top up because the flavor just goes out of it in ferment. I do use mine though sometimes in the primary if it's a sugar f-pak as I like my wines dry. And I have to say to anyone new to wine making kits, you could stop your ferment by using the f pak because it does contain sorbate.

 

[joeswine]

Fpacs




THE REASON FOR A FPAC,is only one to deliver the flavor profile that the manufacture wants as there signature taste and is always used on it's own, if you want to increases the abv-- do it in the primary with simple syrup, if you really want to stop the alcohol process ,you can but you need to have good chemical process controls ,in place this is not recommended for most wine makers., buy using a fpac in anyother manner you have the possibilities of restarting fermentation and then there's no taste left and what remains is wine that's hot. These are proven facts ..................and my experiences..

 

[vernsgal]

Thanks Joe, that's exactly what I was trying to say

 

[Pumpkinman]

you could stop your ferment by using the f pak because it does contain sorbate.

I'll have to respectfully disagree, Sorbate will not stop an active fermentation, it will however stop any new fermentations.

 

[jamesngalveston]

The only way to stop an active ferment is with adding enough alcohol to kill the yeast...sorbate as pumpkin man said, will stop any new ferment unless you add yeast to again..if there is more yeast then what the sorbate can handle, it will start ferment again.

 

[TomK-B]

I think my previous post was misunderstood. Joe said he noticed that the juice level of his RJS port kit was a bit short of the three gallon mark in his primary fermentor, so he added spring water to the juice to bring it up to three gallons. I was trying to say that I had noticed the same thing in my RJS port kit, but decided not to add anything to the juice in the primary fermentor. Instead, I fermented the juice to dry, stabilized with sorbate, added the fining agents, degassed, and then added the f-pack. What I found is that after adding the f-pack at the end the volume had come up to within 375 ml of the proper level. I chose to top up that difference with brandy. What I was trying to say is that I think RJS has designed the kit so that this is what happens.

 

[joeswine]

Makes sense

CORRECT ,THIS HAS BEEN ON GOING ADJUST WITH WINE KITS,THE MANUFACTURES ADJUST TO THE CHEMICAL REACTIONS AND PROPORTIONS AND TIMING , WE THENTS HAVE TO ADJUST TO THE MANUFACTURES SPECTS ,THAT'S WHAT MAKES THIS A GREAT HOBBY AND THEN WE (THINKING OUTSIDE THE BOX).

 

[Neviawen]

This sounds pretty tasty. I have a question though. You say you need 15 wine bottles, but 30 corks and caps. Why not an even amount?

Hi Lori,
I help Joe with his posts and that was my mistake- this is a 3-gallon kit so it should say 3- gallon carboy, as well as 15 bottles, corks, and caps.

Best,
Katie
(Neviawen)

 

[joeswine]

caramel port kit

caramel port continued......

 

[joeswine]

caramel port kit

continued.............

 

[Bartman]

Hi Lori,
I help Joe with his posts...

Best,
Katie
(Neviawen)

Very glad to hear this! No offense intended, but Joe's posts have sometimes been very difficult for me to follow.

 

[bluedog]

Perhaps I missed it, but how much oak tannin was added? The pic suggested a heaping something...teaspoon, tablespoon)?

 

[joeswine]

adding tannins

THERE WAS 1 TABLESPOON ADDED AT THIS POINT,I WANTED TO BOOST UP THE PH IN THE PRIMARY THEN PLAY OFF OF IT LATER IN THE SECONDARY IF NEEDED.(NOT SHOUTING JUST USING LARGER LETTERS).

WHAT A TEAM!

 

[bluedog]

Joe, thanks for confirming the amount on tannin. I have this kit on hand, and am now thinking I will follow your lead and think out outside the box with it. I look forward to following your progress.

 

[joeswine]

Caramel port forward

MOVING WITH THE RACKING///// JUST TO LET YOU KNOW WHAT WAS HAPPENING BEHIND THE SCENES,WE ALSO MADE A COFFEE PORT .THE REASON WE DIDN'T DO IT ON A SEPARATE THREAD IS BECAUSE IT'S THE SAME BASE AND PROCEDURES, WERE WE WILL SPLIT THE TWO IS AT THE SECONDARY,SO PAY ATTENTION,WE WILL LET YOU KNOW WHAT ENHANCEMENTS ARE ADDED TO EACH AND WHEN,BUT IT'S UP TO YOU TO FOLLOW,SOUND INTERESTING???????????????????????? WE MAY ALSO MOVE THIS THREAD TO CLEANING UP SO THAT WE CAN CONTINUE THE AMARONE KIT AND IT'S TRANSISTION TO THE FINISH,THIS WINE IS EXCITTING TO SAY THE LEAST IN TEXTURE AS WELL AS STRUCTURE AND TASTE.......IT SHOWS WHAT YOU CAN DO WITH A GREAT KIT AND THINKING OUTSIDE THE BOX.