Where to buy Oak Barrels?

[Ajmassa]

My first was a 6.6 that works well but when I buy a bucket and one or 2 lugs depending on the season I've been ending up with more then 8 gallons. That is why I went for the 8.

Sounds like the 8 will work well for you then. It's so difficult for me to know how big to go without a set routine of how much I make. I've been eying the Vadai for a while.
Im gonna want 2 barrels tho. And Im not partial to any type. A smaller 5-6gal and a 10-15gal since I started using our old 54L demijohns. So that 13.3 gal would be ideal for transferring. The more I look into barrels the more excited I get.
This Carolina joint seems promising. I did notice they listed the stave thickness on the site (not your email) as 10-18mm. Which I would assume is a taper deal. 10mm is about 3/8" at he bung. You're a builder so you know how a sheet of 3/8" plywood feels when handling. But I look forward to hearing your review, and really hope you've found a winner.

 

[mainshipfred]

I'm anxious to see what it is all about as well. I do see the stave thickness that I couldn't find before. I really find it hard to believe though that the minimum stave thickness is 10mm even though that is what is says. The 10mm aside, one comment on the thread I can't totally agree with is the cost associated with the barrel relative to the thickness of the staves. The cost of the raw material has to be small compared to the cost of milling and labor to build. Hopefully, since we are in the same business you can understand my thoughts.

 

[Johnd]

one comment on the thread I can't totally agree with is the cost associated with the barrel relative to the thickness of the staves. The cost of the raw material has to be small compared to the cost of milling and labor to build. Hopefully, since we are in the same business you can understand my thoughts.

I doubt that the difference in price is solely from raw material costs, but a combination of costs resulting from the difference. Starting off with a piece of 1-1/8" material versus a piece of 3/4" material is significant, there is 50% more thickness in the 1-1/8" piece than the 3/4" piece. Theoretically, 50% more barrels could be produced from the same amount of raw materials.

Machining doesn't seem like it would be a big variable. I suspect that the thinner staves bend easier, requiring less steaming time, and therefore less labor and overall time to construct. Shouldn't be a big difference in toasting either barrels, but shipping costs could be less due to weight as well. Just some food for thought..........

 

[mainshipfred]

JohnD, all your points are well taken and I agree. Just due to my nature and interests I like to evalute costs. While I was researching stave costs I ran across other cooperage articles involving grain. It appears the best barrels are those of a combination of tight and loose grain (separate topic altogether) which I found interesting. There was also an article on the use of thinner staves which evidently had benefits but I can't find where I saw it. Again, all your points are well taken it just my nature to know why things are what they are.

 

[Johnd]

JohnD, all your points are well taken and I agree. Just due to my nature and interests I like to evalute costs. While I was researching stave costs I ran across other cooperage articles involving grain. It appears the best barrels are those of a combination of tight and loose grain (separate topic altogether) which I found interesting. There was also an article on the use of thinner staves which evidently had benefits but I can't find where I saw it. Again, all your points are well taken it just my nature to know why things are what they are.

No worries. I like to know what I’m getting for a buck too!!!

 

[Ajmassa]

noticed after I wrote that this is kinda repetitive.*
But I bet they are just covering their ass with the 10mm. 3/8"-3/4". almost 50% difference! 3/8" has to be heaviest char but Light toast may be at least 1/2"+
I wouldn't mind this for a <10gal. Not too heavy. Grain, surface area, and Time until neutral all would be same as a thicker barrel. At least I think. So, less money for less durability? I can handle that. (Tho I plan for a larger barrel too so I may be biased)
But the low price? I do agree that labor is ALWAYS more expensive than material, but wouldn't 2 identical barrels at 1.25" and 3/4", be similar labor? But 3/4" boards vs 1.25" boards can be double $. Tack on the extra weight affecting s&h and I Believe there's the price difference.
It sounds like your saying material $ may not be the cause and the total cost is mostly from labor. If so, then are your saying these barrels are less $ from less labor. I.e. Shortcuts? I'm probably reading that wrong and unnecessarily going down that wormhole.
So More importantly, when do you receive it and when will it be filled?!

 

[mainshipfred]

I agree the botttom line is does is as I said hold water. They sold out of 8's and their next load is coming in 2 weeks. I would like my MLF to complete before I put it in the barrel. I have 3 wines in the 8 gallon plus range, Syrah, Zin and Norton that I will interchange in the barrel. The first to complete or come close to completing MLF will go in. That is unless I am impatient and just fill it when I get it. If it doesn't work it will be an expensive lamp stand, but, from another thread it won't glow in the dark. I also have a 6.6 gal I'm trying to figure out what to fill with.

 

[Johnd]

I agree the botttom line is does is as I said hold water. They sold out of 8's and their next load is coming in 2 weeks. I would like my MLF to complete before I put it in the barrel. I have 3 wines in the 8 gallon plus range, Syrah, Zin and Norton that I will interchange in the barrel. The first to complete or come close to completing MLF will go in. That is unless I am impatient and just fill it when I get it. If it doesn't work it will be an expensive lamp stand, but, from another thread it won't glow in the dark. I also have a 6.6 gal I'm trying to figure out what to fill with.

You can put wine in there that is undergoing MLF, it’s done all the time! Once you put and MLF’d wine in there, no more kits should go in.

 

[mainshipfred]

Yes, I knew you could. I just wanted to leave a bit of lees in the wine for MLF nutrients. Thought after MLF I would rack it to make cleaning the barrel easier. BTW, on another note, I emailed Mosti and asked about MLFing their juice kits. The response was they don't use sorbates and MLF was possible. They warned of SO2 levels since the ph would be raised and the potential of H2S. I'm going to try MLF on an Amorone from them but just one gallon and see what happens.

 

[Ajmassa]

If it doesn't work it will be an expensive lamp stand, but, from another thread it won't glow in the dark. I also have a 6.6 gal I'm trying to figure out what to fill with.

Ah yes. The infamous Chernobyl forest barrels. Lol
I think it's a safe bet that this barrel will 'work'.
Congrats on the purchase. I'm happy for ya. I plan to have my 1st for spring grapes. Still figuring out my local options compared to online w/shipping. And any time you share one of these links for different barrel distributors I'm on it. Unfortunately I saw Carolina only delivers to within 200 miles.

 

[mainshipfred]

noticed after I wrote that this is kinda repetitive.*
But I bet they are just covering their ass with the 10mm. 3/8"-3/4". almost 50% difference! 3/8" has to be heaviest char but Light toast may be at least 1/2"+
I wouldn't mind this for a <10gal. Not too heavy. Grain, surface area, and Time until neutral all would be same as a thicker barrel. At least I think. So, less money for less durability? I can handle that. (Tho I plan for a larger barrel too so I may be biased)
But the low price? I do agree that labor is ALWAYS more expensive than material, but wouldn't 2 identical barrels at 1.25" and 3/4", be similar labor? But 3/4" boards vs 1.25" boards can be double $. Tack on the extra weight affecting s&h and I Believe there's the price difference.
It sounds like your saying material $ may not be the cause and the total cost is mostly from labor. If so, then are your saying these barrels are less $ from less labor. I.e. Shortcuts? I'm probably reading that wrong and unnecessarily going down that wormhole.
So More importantly, when do you receive it and when will it be filled?!

I probably didn't explain my self properly. Not knowing the cost breakdown for labor and material my thought process was and just an example, if the material cost was 20% and labor 80% doubling the material would make it 40/60. Now if the material cost was 40% and you doubled it that would be an entirely different story as the labor wouldn't be as much of a factor. But as John said bending the thinner staves would be easier as well and save on labor.

 

[mainshipfred]

I don't believe the 200 miles is correct on their website. I believe they ship anywhere and he said they get good rates fron UPS.

 

[Ajmassa]

I don't believe the 200 miles is correct on their website. I believe they ship anywhere and he said they get good rates fron UPS.

Great. thanks! Maybe that was just for the $50 flat rate delivery then.

 

[SouthernChemist]

I saw in the description that these barrels have no bung hole, but they will drill one for one you upon request. What is the typical bung hole size for a barrel?

 

[mainshipfred]

I saw in the description that these barrels have no bung hole, but they will drill one for one you upon request. What is the typical bung hole size for a barrel?

I asked for a 1 3/4" just because I have a bung to fit.

 

[mainshipfred]

Received my Carolina barrel today, The staves are a full 1" thick at the bung. Only has 2 hoops on each side though and I haven't checked for leaks yet. Looks great though and it comes with a stand and spigot.

 

[ibglowin]

Received my Carolina barrel today, The staves are a full 1" thick at the bung. Only has 2 hoops on each side though and I haven't checked for leaks yet. Looks great though and it comes with a stand and spigot.

 

[mainshipfred]

Here you go. Will prep today, fingers crossed it holds water. With regard to cost, what I noticed is it's not as curved as my other barrel and only has 2 hoops on each side. It's still oak and still a barrel but maybe without the extra hoop and curvature the cost of making the barrel is reduced. Perhaps the third hoop is whats necessary for the additional curvature. With all that said I think it will still perforn the functions of a barrel.

 

[stickman]

There is a knot in one of the staves which wouldn't be there if they were holding to the heartwood standard. That being said, as long as it holds wine and performs as you expect, you're good to go.

 

[SouthernChemist]

Received my Carolina barrel today, The staves are a full 1" thick at the bung. Only has 2 hoops on each side though and I haven't checked for leaks yet. Looks great though and it comes with a stand and spigot.

Nice that it came with a stand! Ultimately, it seems like as long as it holds wine, it would be a decent enough value.