Wine topping

[sour_grapes]

Yes, you can eliminate headspace air, you just need to right tools. A Vacuvin pump can't do it as it is not strong enough and the rubber stopper leaks.

But if you use a good electric vacuum pump that can pull ~20" Hg and have a tight seal on everything so it doesn't leak back in after you pump out the headspace you have no worries about oxidation anymore.

Mike, I know 20" is near perfect vacuum where you live, but for the rest of us, that would only remove about 2/3 of the oxygen. Why don't you think the remaining 1/3 of oxygen is problematic?

 

[ibglowin]

Lets just say I have access to some of the finest analytical GC/MS (gas sampling) instrumentation your tax dollars can buy.

 

[sour_grapes]

I understand that you cannot discuss in detail, but do you find a stoichiometry that is significantly different from air?

 

[ibglowin]

The ratios (percentages) are the same as far as 02/N2 its just not enough O2 left to worry about IMHO especially since I only use it for a few days until it clears well which is like 7-10 days max, then I rack and top up. I do GC and GC/MS on both liquids and gases every single day at work. We have some really nice gas sampling manifolds including pumping stations with both rough and turbo pumps. We use quick disconnects that allow you to pump down a system, then attach an evacuated sample container to it, attach, open valve, expand into container and then close the valve and attach to GC or GC/MS and expand into manifold and analyze.

 

[vacuumpumpman]

Yes, you can eliminate headspace air, you just need to right tools. A Vacuvin pump can't do it as it is not strong enough and the rubber stopper leaks.

But if you use a good electric vacuum pump that can pull ~20" Hg and have a tight seal on everything so it doesn't leak back in after you pump out the headspace you have no worries about oxidation anymore.

Well if people are using the allinone which pulls a steady 22 in of vacuum with the headspace eliminator - a tool that keeps the vacuum trapped in the carboy - would you say that it is a good thing then ?


I know if you can flood the carboy with a inert gas it would be best - But there are alot of people who do not have access to inert gas.
Thanks Steve

 

[user 32114]

hum after reading the last 3 or 4 tech remarks made here this simpleton hillbilly is dropping a 10mg opioid with 750 ml of wine, followed by a Xanax.
I've just been set back years on what I once considered simple wine making,:: jeeze karma is such a ***** anymore,,, lol
Dawg (puppy)

 

[sdelli]

Bottom line... Do not leave head space and replace it with gas!

 

[Tnuscan]

It will go bad if you have too much headspace for too long without some form of intervention. I use one gallon jugs to top up my barrels and I backfill them with Argon and a tight stopper. This works great for a couple weeks, then I repeat the process. When I get down to half gallon left in the jug I will rack down to a growler or a couple of 1.5L wine bottles.

How long is to long with 6 inches of headspace in a glass carboy?

 

[sour_grapes]

Here is what I don't get: On this forum, if you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling 1 wine bottle, random people will yell at you, unbidden, to top up your carboy lest it be ruined by oxidation. If you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling, say, 5 wine bottles, but you pulled a 20" vacuum on it, people will give you a thumb's up. And yet the latter contains a lot more oxygen than the former.

 

[vacuumpumpman]

@ Paul -

I would have to find the video where i used the headspace eliminator to remove a bottle of wine and suck it in by vacuum alone - I believe the numbers were approx 43 ml difference -

but I will do more back checking -

here is the actual live video testing

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWfUOU6Z1ZE[/ame]

so 5 bottles of headspace equals approx 305 ml when using the headspace eliminator - that is less than 1/2 of a bottle in a 5 bottle area.

And hopefully the CO2 will compensate the aid in the reduction of headspace - You can always add a heavier gas mixture to aid in this process

 

[Brian55]

Here's what I don't get. Why not simply top up with a similar wine, be it store bought or something from your personal inventory?
As a side note. I have access to vacuum pumps that will pull down to 28hg. But I no longer use them since I have no idea as to what else you're pulling out at that point?

 

[Brian55]

Bottom line... Do not leave head space and replace it with gas!

Do not leave head space, replace it with wine!!!!!!!

 

[Tnuscan]

Here is what I don't get: On this forum, if you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling 1 wine bottle, random people will yell at you, unbidden, to top up your carboy lest it be ruined by oxidation. If you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling, say, 5 wine bottles, but you pulled a 20" vacuum on it, people will give you a thumb's up. And yet the latter contains a lot more oxygen than the former.

I have been trying to find the answers to this for at least a week.
I never worried about this until a couple weeks ago. Always having headspace I feel my wines suffered now I know why. Any hoo I must be asking the wrong questions, because I came across the last half of the "wine topping" thread and found the answers. lol

What is a private message?

Thanks

 

[vacuumpumpman]

What is a private message?

Thanks[/QUOTE]

It is when you give a private message to an individual

 

[Tnuscan]

Do not leave head space, replace it with wine!!!!!!!

I'm making Vintners Black currant, what do I fill the void with if I' m wanting Vintners Black currant?

 

[sour_grapes]

I'm making Vintners Black currant, what do I fill the void with if I' m wanting Vintners Black currant?

Rather than fill the void, you can rack down to a smaller container. Or you could add glass marbles (clean, lead-free) to the carboy.

 

[NorCal]

Here is what I don't get: On this forum, if you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling 1 wine bottle, random people will yell at you, unbidden, to top up your carboy lest it be ruined by oxidation. If you show a picture of a carboy with headspace equaling, say, 5 wine bottles, but you pulled a 20" vacuum on it, people will give you a thumb's up. And yet the latter contains a lot more oxygen than the former.

When I make a 30/60 gallon barrel, I try to make enough extra in a carboy to satisfy the topping needs. I am very protective of the barrel and was skeptical of the ability of the head space eliminator to protect my wine (as I posted in another thread). At this point I had all my 1 gallon and 64 ounce containers filled with other wine, so I was kind of in a bind, because I needed to rack the barrel. I decided to give the HSE a try and it worked for me. I've since bottled the rest of the topping wine. I'm pragmatic and the HSE proved to be a useful tool when I was in a bind.

 

[kevinlfifer]

I'm with Brian, I now have 500+ bottles on the rack, so what if I have to drink two extra glasses on top off day.

 

[sdelli]

Even if it did work... Which I still doubt all oxygen is gone.... I do not want to age my wine under vacuum!

 

[sour_grapes]

so 5 bottles of headspace equals approx 305 ml when using the headspace eliminator - that is less than 1/2 of a bottle in a 5 bottle area.

So, Steve, have you officially changed your estimate of the pressure your pump pulls? The numbers you just cited indicate a vacuum gauge pressure of 27.5 inHg. That is great! This is about what I calculated way back when when you first posted your video. It is not easy to build an oil-free pump that draws that deep of a vacuum -- you should be very proud.