Aging after clearing

[DragonTail]

I have a number of gallon batches going. The recipes say that even after clearing, they should age around 4 months before bottling. My question is, especially for such small batches, is there a reason the wine can't be bottled and aged that way instead of being in the gallon jug? Is there really that much of difference? Does the wine age differently under the airlock as apposed to being in the bottle?

 

[Rice_Guy]

Two answers, ,,, well a few thoughts
* first is that the aging in five separate 750 ml bottles versus one 3,780 ml will be similar. The process of getting the wine into the bottle introduces measurable oxygen which pushes the oxidation cascade faster so if you are hoping for long storage staying in the gallon can be beneficial.
* second any wine will have fine particulates in suspension. Individual yeast cells floating in the wine aren’t immediately visible, if you try to read print through a glass you may see it slightly blur or if you test in a spectrophotometer you will show something is absorbing some light. If I am looking at contest wine it is common (1 out of 40) to see some fine lees if the wine is from the last harvest season.
* a third way to look at aging processes is the risk. I have made gallon fermenters and not made time to finish. At three years the airlock may have dried out and the taste is funky so I never bottle, ,,, and I would have been smarter either to bottle early or not do the test.

Conclusion, if you are careful about fine lees it doesn’t make much difference.

 

[Ohio Bob]

I have a number of gallon batches going. The recipes say that even after clearing, they should age around 4 months before bottling. My question is, especially for such small batches, is there a reason the wine can't be bottled and aged that way instead of being in the gallon jug? Is there really that much of difference? Does the wine age differently under the airlock as apposed to being in the bottle?

For reds 4 months is too soon, fine lee sediment is still dropping. Many people bulk age at least 9 months or more. For whites, the earliest would be to bottle at 6 months.

Secondly, the ullage (aka headspace) in your carboy will, or should be at a minimum. The ullage in a bottle of wine will be a higher percentage of the volume of the wine. So the degrading effect of oxygen in aging will be less for your carboy.

 

[Sailor323]

I will take a contrarian point of view. While aging in larger containers prior to bottling is preferable, there is no reason to avoid bottling soon after completion of fermentation and clearing. Beaujolais Nouveau is bottled within weeks of picking the grapes. Instructions for kit wines suggest bottling as soon as 4 weeks after pitching the yeast. Depending on the variety I sometimes bottle as soon as 6 weeks after pitching (rack and clarify 2 weeks after pitching yeast, rack off lees 2 weeks later, bottle 2 weeks later). I don't do this often and when I do I get sediment and tartrate crystals in the bottle. I only do this when I want a fast-drinking wine like Gamay. I say bottle when you want.

 

[winemanden]

Beaujolais Nouveau is just that, New Beaujolais. It was never intended for keeping, it was just a stunt thought up by one of the London newspapers in 1973. The Idea was a prize for the first newly vinted Beaujolais to reach London. A bunch of monied twits used to race each other back to London with a case or two of Beaujolais. This link tells the full story.
https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/articles/its-the-50th-anniversary-of-the-beaujolais-nouveau-race-67141/

 

[Budding Vintner]

My assumption is that the biggest benefit to bulk aging is when you age in oak. I'm not convinced that aging for 3 months in a glass carboy is going to produce noticeably better wine than aging in the bottle. Maybe the benefit is in proportion to the length of time it spends in the carboy, but 3 months carboy + 3 months in the bottle isn't going to beat 6 months in the bottle, on average. I'm speculating; my opinion is not based on experience.

 

[Raptor99]

I make country wine, which usually benefits from a little bit of backsweetening. The taste of the wine changes during aging, so I usually age them at least 6 months before bottling so that I can adjust the sweetness to the appropriate level. If you do any adjustments for taste before bottling, it is helpful to age a bit longer in the carboy.

If you do not do any taste adjustments at all before bottling, I don't see any benefit to bottling sooner, as long as the wine is completely clear.

 

[Rice_Guy]

My assumption is that the biggest benefit to bulk aging is when you age in oak. . . . Maybe the benefit is in proportion to the length of time it spends in the carboy, . . . my opinion

Oak? my assumption is that Scott Labs has tannins that accomplish similar functions to what oak polyphenols contribute.
Age? ,,, alcohol combines with acids over time the net effect is that the TA decreases and pH rises. The wine tastes sweeter and loses some of its long term stability. ,,, Low rates of oxygen exposure as with HDPE or oak barrels will cause polyphenols to polymerize and the sharp flavors decrease. Fast oxygen exposure will preferentially oxidize alcohol creating acetaldehyde which at levels over 100 ppm produces a burn in the back of the throat. ,,, Age in oak barrels concentrates the solids, in HDPE or glass or stainless there isn’t a concentration effect. ,,, Age permits solids to agglomerate and settle or if we are unlucky like proteins in white wine the polymerize creating cloudiness and eventually a film that settles on the walls. ,,, Age

Looking at the chemistry an aluminum cap sealed/ nitrogen flushed should perform as well as a sealed carboy. Granted gunk settles so one should decant the wine if it is in a 750 ml bottle. ,,, Also the ullage (oxygen to volume ratio) is higher with smaller containers. ,,, Unfortunately Home wine makers don’t have the tools to easily control oxygen.

 

[WilsonBTS]

It's actually pretty flexible. Bottling your wine after clearing is totally fine, especially for smaller batches. Aging in the bottle can work just as well, and sometimes it's even better for space and taste consistency. The main difference is how much air the wine is exposed to; bottles tend to have less air exposure than a jug under an airlock.

 

[Jusatele]

I age in 3 gallon carboys and will age as long as I do not need that carboy. up to a year at times

the thing I do notice is that different types of wine can be sensitive to how it is aged. fruit wines do not need so much ageing as a dark red grape wine would, and it seems to me that white wines do not benefit as much either. It may be the tannin count, I do not know the answer.

Do I suggest bigger container aging........YES. Can I say what the size should be.....NO

As always, your note book is your best friend, as anything you do to a wine can effect it. If you notice a change refer back to the notes of that batch and the notes of others to start pin pointing the change. I write some of the strangest notes and aging container and size is one that you should note.

 

[Tripled92]

As others have said unless you are trying to age in a barrel I don’t see the difference of 1 year in a bottle vs 1 year in a glass carboy. I’ve seen other forums where people claim that bulk aging is better because since it’s all on one jar it’s more consistent but really haven’t seen anything to really support that claim or make a bunch of people take bulk over bottle. I feel do what you think is best. I personally bottle age.

 

[tjmeyer]

Just going to weigh in here from what I've seen in the industry. Aging in bottle is ABSOLUTELY a thing. If the wine is not going on oak (for oxidation and oak flavoring) then it often goes right into bottle to be stored in the cellar--typically without cap and label. This doesn't happen with all wines, of course. But it is an option that is done as a normal thing. More expensive wines will go to barrel first to bulk age. I don't see anyone bulk aging in neutral containers like stainless or glass.

To be perfectly clear (lol nice pun), I'm talking about aging, not clarifying. You shouldn't bottle unclear wine. Clarifying without fining agents can take 3-12 months and is done for some wines. But here's the dirty secret: most wineries use kieselsol/chitosan or isinglass fining ingredients and bottle within 2 weeks of crush unless they're intending to make a $50+ bottle of wine. I guarantee that any wine <$70 a bottle is not aged on new oak AND clarified with only time, the market for that kind of cost just isn't huge. It's done all the time, but that is not the bulk of what folks are selling, therefore making.

There is a reason bottle aged wines are always in flat-sided bottles--that doesn't mean all flat sided bottles are bottled aged, though! More of than not when you hear "limited release" or "reserve" (really these words mean nothing, technically) they are likely made without fining and/or bulk aged in new barrels because they have no need to make more than a couple hundred gallons--it just doesn't sell enough at the price necessary to keep it up. Here are some examples from a winery I'm familiar with and can vouge for their quality.
2020 Sangiovese this is bottle aged and finings are used. It is and EXCELLENT wine. Notice the shape of the bottle. They are stacked side by side on large shelves for a year before being labelled and capped.
Attached are pictures (credit) of the aging of this wine. In the pictures there are labels on them, but typically they do not stack them labelled because it can damage the labels on the bottom rows.
2022 PINOT NOIR this is barrel aged and much younger than the 2020. Notice the price hike, this is normal. Also an EXCELLENT wine, but you're paying for their new oak barrels. I am unsure about how this specific wine was clarified, but based on the price I would assume it went into the barrel fined and clear.
2018 IL BARONE absolutely no corners are cut on this wine! This is the wine they'll put in most of the their promotional materials that include how to make wine. It's mentioned in this video also. It's also the wine they'll sell the least of and requires a majority of the work ($$) and time ($$) to make.
2022 LA FANTASIA in contrast, this is a fast made, sweet, BIG selling, money maker wine that is fined in large stainless steel vats and quickly bottled. I love this wine but it's not really "aged" in the classic sense at all with the exception of how long it takes to go from bottling to consumer's mouth.

None of these are bad wines, and none of these methods are incorrect! The only difference is what flavor profile the winemaker is after, and this is typically decided before the grapes are even crushed.