WineXpert "Contre Le Vent" CabSauv First Batch Journal

[Johnd]

Thanks Clark. I'm still looking for that type of wine thief - I know exactly the type you mentioned. I haven't been able to track one down yet and the only ones I see are the ones with the thumb hole so I'm using a turkey baster for a wine thief at the moment and purchased a standing test tube in the meantime. I am already into the PH testing and SO2 analysis, this kit is about to go into bulk aging and PH is 3.6 currently.

Kit #2 will be started in the next few days when the store gets more cabernet sauvignon juice in and I'll be experimenting a bit this round. I am going to add some pressed blackberries, dried plums, zante black currants, and some black cherry flavoring to the kit. I had a blend recently and I managed to track down the percentages used for each of the ingredients so I'm going to imitate it the best I can and this will be my first tweaked kit.

For 6 bucks, no reason not to have a couple. Dunk it in and lift out your sample, drop in the hydrometer for a reading, return the sample, done.

http://labelpeelers.com/equipment/testing/fermtech-wine-thief/?gclid=CKb_jrOJqtMCFdgQgQod4lANzw

 

[CabSauv]

For 6 bucks, no reason not to have a couple. Dunk it in and lift out your sample, drop in the hydrometer for a reading, return the sample, done.

http://labelpeelers.com/equipment/testing/fermtech-wine-thief/?gclid=CKb_jrOJqtMCFdgQgQod4lANzw

Yep, I thought about online but the shipping and possibility of breaking crossed my mind. The store where I get all my equipment was just out of them. I will be frequenting there a lot so I'll pick a few up when they get more in stock.

UPDATE 8:
So it begins...

 

[Boatboy24]

UPDATE 8:
So it begins...

Now comes the hard part.

 

[CabSauv]

Now comes the hard part.

Luckily over the summer, unless I am out to dinner, grilling steak, or having other wine drinking company over, I drink less wine and more beer. It won't be easy but I'm determined to make this first batch worth all the attention to detail. I want it to be a memory. I'll likely save at least 1 bottle for 10 years or so to see how good a kit tastes after 10 years in the bottle and compare it to my future kits to gauge my improvements.

 

[Ajmassa]

I hear they peak around 5 years. I wish I'd done that and saved a bottle from each batch.
I just recently opened a bottle I thought was from a so so batch from last year. But turned out to be a straggler from a 2013 juice batch. (One day I'll do labels). It was unbelievable. By far the best wine i had ever made. It was pretty darn good at 12-18 months. But this was something entirely different. The nose, balance and finish all had improved more than i really even realized was possible. I don't think I've ever let any wine go past 2 years before consumed. Taught me a lesson for sure. It was straight Cab Sauv juice batch from 2013. I gotta look more into when kits and juice batches typically peak out.

 

[CabSauv]

I hear they peak around 5 years. I wish I'd done that and saved a bottle from each batch.
I just recently opened a bottle I thought was from a so so batch from last year. But turned out to be a straggler from a 2013 juice batch. (One day I'll do labels). It was unbelievable. By far the best wine i had ever made. It was pretty darn good at 12-18 months. But this was something entirely different. The nose, balance and finish all had improved more than i really even realized was possible. I don't think I've ever let any wine go past 2 years before consumed. Taught me a lesson for sure. It was straight Cab Sauv juice batch from 2013. I gotta look more into when kits and juice batches typically peak out.

Do you think 10 years would be too long for a kit wine? I look forward to seeing how the same wine changes year to year.

 

[Ajmassa]

Waiting for others to chime in. I honestly don't know. Pretty sure I read quality starts to drop after about 5 years in kits.
For juice batches I would think the wine would stay better for longer. Like I said i tasted a red I made over 4 years ago and was way better than 2 years ago. I'm also Curious for how long till they peak out. Most likely not a straight answer with all the types of reds/whites and dif kits all factoring in

 

[CabSauv]

Waiting for others to chime in. I honestly don't know. Pretty sure I read quality starts to drop after about 5 years in kits.
For juice batches I would think the wine would stay better for longer. Like I said i tasted a red I made over 4 years ago and was way better than 2 years ago. I'm also Curious for how long till they peak out. Most likely not a straight answer with all the types of reds/whites and dif kits all factoring in

I can only assume that I will drink most/all of them within 5 years. I guess it depends on this next batch and how many batches I end up doing year to year. But, for the purpose of seeing how the taste, body, and profile changes I will likely try to save one or two for the purpose of long term testing. The goal is in 5 years or so, I hope to have enough batches done and under my belt that anything I drink from then on will all have been aged and in the bottle for a few years already anyway.

 

[Boatboy24]

I have a few that are approaching 5 years. For those that haven't gotten that far, my experience has been that they tend to peak around 3, but may stay at a plateau for a while before beginning to decline. For high end kits, I don't think 5 years is unreasonable at all. 10 may be a bit much though - especially if not using a quality cork.

 

[CabSauv]

UPDATE 9:
I added a few oak cubes for the first 3 months of bulk aging so I can front load the aging with tannin so at next rack I can remove them and allow the tannins more time to smooth out.

BATCH #2 STARTED:
I started another batch of WineXpert Cabernet Sauvignon which I am ultimately calling "Contre Le Vent" (translation: "Against the Wind") and this time I added cut/partially smashed plum and blackberry to primary. The starting SG was a little low so I ended up adding about 8 ounces of sugar, got it at or slightly above 1.096 and potential ABV was 12.8% and should end up in the 12.8%-13.4% range depending on when I stop secondary. Using the food thermometer to get the must right at 75* has been my specialty and it works like a charm. The air lock was already showing activity about 8 hours after pitching the yeast.

Good to go!

 

[Ajmassa]

So another kit instead of a pale of Chilean juice??? There's still time ya know! Lol
Did you add straight sugar or a simple syrup mix(recommended)? And What kind of winexpert kits are these? Eclipse, world vineyard, vintners reserve, selection etc...? Just curious

 

[CabSauv]

So another kit instead of a pale of Chilean juice??? There's still time ya know! Lol
Did you add straight sugar or a simple syrup mix(recommended)? And What kind of winexpert kits are these? Eclipse, world vineyard, vintners reserve, selection etc...? Just curious

They're Vintners Reserve. I took some juice from the must and gradually added sugar while stirring and stirred until it was all dissolved, then added it back and stirred the must thoroughly. I wanted to do the same kit so I can compare the final result from batch #1 to the final results of batch #2 with my slight tweaks and addition of experience.

I have been tasting batch #1 (currently just a few weeks into bulk aging) a few times and I'm still having trouble identifying if it needs anything or not. As of now, after visual inspection, it's surprisingly not as inky or purple as I expected it to be at such a young age, it was already looking more of a ruby red(??) Hopefully that's not a sign of rapid oxidation. For flavor, while still a slight tartness to it which I expect to smooth out eventually, it's almost got a sense of blandness or lacking something. It wasn't as bold or full bodied (that thickness/syrup-like mouth that a good cab has). Since this is my first rodeo, I'm not sure if something is needed other than time or not. It's not skunky or unpleasant, it's just difficult for me as a drinker who is used to a final product to taste wine at this stage and know what it needs or should be. So since I'm out of my element all I can do is be patient and let time do it's thing.

 

[mainshipfred]

Doug, we are in the same boat. I recently posted the same concern about my wine needing something but not knowing what or what to add. Fotunately Boatboy lives near me and offered to help. My first kit was a cheap 10L Malbec so I don't give it much hope to be excellent.

 

[mainshipfred]

There was a post with a link about a small Cab Sauv wine maker who posted his log book but I can't find it. Does anyone know where it was?

 

[sour_grapes]

There was a post with a link about a small Cab Sauv wine maker who posted his log book but I can't find it. Does anyone know where it was?

Do you mean this one: http://www.winemakingtalk.com/forum/showpost.php?p=646667&postcount=9

Here's an update and an admission. I made a very rookie mistake.

Started this on 3/5/17 with an initial SG of 1.108 at 65 degrees, a little chilly, but I wanted it to be fruit forward. Yeast provided was RC-212 and I made short cycle yeast starter. The kit came with dried skins and oak chips, I added 1/2 cup Zantes yellow raisins and 2 cubes of grated dark baker's chocolate.

2 days later the temp was up to 77 and then 80 the following day with good action at each punch down. Continued to punch down 1 to 2 times per day until 3/18. This is where I flubbed up. Since the action had ceased, the must had gotten to a decent temperature and it had been 13 days, I assumed it was finished and did not take a hydrometer reading (duh!). I racked to a 6.5 Gal carboy for degassing and clarification. I added the K-meta, kieselsol and chitosan, but did not add K sorbate (thank God). On 4/1 I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and a 3 L jug.

On checking the SG this AM I found it to still be at 1.010 - yikes! Still some RS left in there for sure. Fortunately, 5 gal is still under airlock and has not been treated with sorbate so the plan now is to leave it under airlock for at least a few months and monitor the SG. If the SG does not come down to dry then I will have to sorbate it when it comes time to bottle.

I already bottled the set aside 3L jug so I'll be opening those bottles fairly soon to avoid the possibility of bottle bombs. It tastes so good that this will not be an inconvenience. Live and learn. Luckily, round 2 is on its way to me so I have a chance to give it another try. Hope this is helpful.

I'm not sure what I will do different this next time around except to start it a bit warmer and possibly leave it in primary a little longer. Attached are my notes.

 

[mainshipfred]

No, it was a small commercial wine maker that seemed to only make Cab Sauv. People commented on how sucessful he would be selling for $60.00+ a bottle. I don't believe he had a vineyard but was very selective where bought his grapes. There were many comments on the post.

 

[Ajmassa]

http://www.maloneywine.com/the-wines/
From Washington state. He has a good amount of notes on each year. Some of his processes and techniques go way beyond a basement dwellers capability though

 

[mainshipfred]

That's it, thank you.

 

[CabSauv]

That's good reading material at least, but as mentioned it's not something I can do with my current budget or setup unfortunately. My next step will be to make a kit that has skins and see how it results in comparison to one without. I am still interested to see how batch 2 ends up with the plum and blackberries added in the must and see if it makes much of a difference to batch 1. Now that I have 2 batches going, it will be a while before I get to a kit with skins anyway and if I do upgrade equipment in the near future, if anything at all, it will be an oak barrel.

Hope isn't all lost though, batches 1 & 2 from non-skin kits still have plenty of time to age and I'll see how they end up. Unfortunately all this just means I'm a wine snob, but lucky for me my determination and enjoyment of a fine glass of wine dictates more attention to detail. Game on.

 

[lilvixen]

Hey Doug,

I started last summer the same way way you are now, so I'll throw in my experience.

I did a WE World Vineyard Trinity Red first to learn on. It had a weird smell to me, like salami, even in the juice before fermenting, but it was a good one to make mistakes on. Next, I tried a 10L with skins kit, CC Sterling Malbec, and it was a step up from the Trinity, but still meh, like a discount house wine. Similar to you, they were missing something, but in order to understand the hobby, I needed to know how the different levels tasted. Last summer, I also started a premium kit, RJS En Primeur Super Tuscan, 16L with skins. It was magnitudes better than the 10L kits throughout the entire process - it smelled better, it tasted better, and the only thing it was missing to me was a bit of tannin, but that's a personal taste thing.

So where I'm going with this: if you're a wine snob, jump up to the 16L/18L with skins kits. They are absolutely worth it, and if you watch for sale prices, they're $30 more for significantly better taste. I didn't think of myself as a wine snob until I was underwhelmed by the Trinity and Malbec wines. In Jan, I started a WE Eclipse Lodi Cab and CC Showcase Carmenere; they're bulk aging right now, and they're great! I'd even be so bold to say that they're currently comparable to the $10-15 commercial bottles we drink. I think the Cab still has a little gas, which I'll need to deal with before bottling, but the Carmenere is absolutely fantastic. The CC Showcase instructions say 10 days in primary on skins, and I think it made a huge difference in the flavor and degassing, so I'll continue that method on future kits.

The Trinity and Malbec are about 10 months old now, and I don't think they're any better than they were at 4 months old. But I told hubby we're not allowed to put the premium kits into rotation until we finish them off, otherwise we'll never go back to them. So if you're looking to satiate your inner snob, I recommend the premium skins kits with a 10-day primary. It's worth it.

I look forward to hearing how your second kit with fruit turns out. Keep us posted!