Finer Wine Kit Finer Wine Kits

[Matteo_Lahm]

Everything stated here is absolutely correct. And yes, you should’ve received a note. Thanks for letting me know.

My last batch of kits did not, either.

It's all about food safety, and when we have products that pass through numerous hands and spend months in storage, safety features are important. However, in this case I don't see a problem, as the kits are assembled by a small team, shipped, and in our hands within a couple of days. If the box arrives sealed, it's not been tampered with.

@Matteo_Lahm, I don't recall seeing a note in my kits, which arrived in November.

 

[jgmann67]

You should’ve gotten a little note in the box that explained the safety tab. Because of supply chain issues, we could not get a quick re-order of our usual bags and had to buy a substitute. we will be returning to our normal bags as soon as possible.
Sorry about the confusion.
Matteo

I didn’t see it. But then again, I wasn’t looking.

Thank you for the explanation Matteo.

I know the directions say to toss the seeds and oak chips right in the juice. But for an easier racking, I like to put those in the bags with the skins.

I kicked off the ferment this morning. It looks and smells spectacular.

 

[Old Corker]

I know the directions say to toss the seeds and oak chips right in the juice. But for an easier racking, I like to put those in the bags with the skins.

I was going to do that but wanted to EM without the seeds.

 

[winemaker81]

I know the directions say to toss the seeds and oak chips right in the juice. But for an easier racking, I like to put those in the bags with the skins.

I thought of doing that ... while I was racking my kits.

Seeds are a PITA. My thought is to put about half the skin pack in the bag, add the seeds, then add the remainder of the pack -- to keep the seeds from escaping.

What helps is a the hi-tech racking jig I made -- 2' of 4" PVC pipe with LOTS of 1/4" holes drilled in the last 8" of one end of the pipe. I wrap it in a fine straining bag and put the racking cane inside the pipe. It prevents all but the finest debris from getting in.

I was going to do that but wanted to EM without the seeds.

Put the seeds in a small straining bag and tie it shut for easy removal when you want.

 

[Matteo_Lahm]

Excellent! You can add them to the skin packs however, they do actually serve a function by just pouring them in. That’s why we opted to go that route with the instructions. Those seeds will eventually sink to the bottom and they actually help displace wine when you transfer to secondary fermentation. It helps you get more wine out of the bucket. Every drop counts.

QUOTE="jgmann67, post: 814764, member: 32653"]
I didn’t see it. But then again, I wasn’t looking.

Thank you for the explanation Matteo.

I know the directions say to toss the seeds and oak chips right in the juice. But for an easier racking, I like to put those in the bags with the skins.

I kicked off the ferment this morning. It looks and smells spectacular.
[/QUOTE]

 

[winemaker81]

It helps you get more wine out of the bucket. Every drop counts

I have a large funnel with a strainer, and pour the last bit of wine through it. Every drop does count!

 

[ratflinger]

Speaking of the amber whites - just pulled my Muscato & Riesling out of the fermenter, after a month, and into my 6.5 gal kill carboys. In the carboys both look quite amber, but not so much in a glass, maybe just a step darker than wheat. They taste as they should at this point and as this is all for personal consumption I'm not going to worry about the color.

 

[Matteo_Lahm]

We have some tests in the works to deal with a color issue. Browning is a limitation of working with white concentrates that are not ultra pasteurized. It has no effect whatsoever on the taste.
Matteo

Speaking of the amber whites - just pulled my Muscato & Riesling out of the fermenter, after a month, and into my 6.5 gal kill carboys. In the carboys both look quite amber, but not so much in a glass, maybe just a step darker than wheat. They taste as they should at this point and as this is all for personal consumption I'm not going to worry about the color.

 

[Swedeman]

Browning is a limitation of working with white concentrates that are not ultra pasteurized.

I guess the enzymes responsible for browning in grapes aren't thermally inactivated, like polyphenol oxidase that is responsible for browning in grape juice.

I really do hope you guys solve this as you got a really nice concept for wine kits.

 

[Matteo_Lahm]

We really appreciate that. Like anything else, the devil is always on the details. you solve one problem and you find 3 more. Right now we are testing a fining agent specifically designed for this issue. Browning is an even bigger problem with fresh grapes so at least there is a breadcrumb trail for us to follow. We will let everyone know how the results turn out.

I guess the enzymes responsible for browning in grapes aren't thermally inactivated, like polyphenol oxidase that is responsible for browning in grape juice.

I really do hope you guys solve this as you got a really nice concept for wine kits.

 

[jgmann67]

We really appreciate that. Like anything else, the devil is always on the details. you solve one problem and you find 3 more. Right now we are testing a fining agent specifically designed for this issue. Browning is an even bigger problem with fresh grapes so at least there is a breadcrumb trail for us to follow. We will let everyone know how the results turn out.

i volunteer as a beta tester.

 

[Matteo_Lahm]

Done! When I notify everyone about the results, hit me up.

i volunteer as a beta tester.

 

[winemaker81]

Done! When I notify everyone about the results, hit me up.

As you are aware, all my notes are online (see my sig, search works well on my site), and you're free to use my notes as you see fit.

 

[Brian55]

We have some tests in the works to deal with a color issue. Browning is a limitation of working with white concentrates that are not ultra pasteurized. It has no effect whatsoever on the taste.
Matteo

Count me as someone who doesn't care about the color. Just the taste!

 

[joeswine]

Good point, although it does help, ??

 

[Rocky]

Just thinking and wondering, in the past I have purchased juice of white varieties in 6-gallon refrigerated buckets from Italy, California and Chile. I do not recall any of these being "off color" to any great degree and they are purported to be "pure varietal juice." Does anyone know how these juices are processed? The impression that the producers give is that the white grapes are pressed, and the juice is bucketed, perhaps with the addition of K-meta. I am thinking that they must do something else to the juice before it is bucketed but I don't know what.

I should also add that these buckets of white varieties normally make excellent wines. However, I did get a Pinot Grigio once from California which was very forgettable.

 

[cmason1957]

Just thinking and wondering, in the past I have purchased juice of white varieties in 6-gallon refrigerated buckets from Italy, California and Chile. I do not recall any of these being "off color" to any great degree and they are purported to be "pure varietal juice." Does anyone know how these juices are processed? The impression that the producers give is that the white grapes are pressed, and the juice is bucketed, perhaps with the addition of K-meta. I am thinking that they must do something else to the juice before it is bucketed but I don't know what.

I should also add that these buckets of white varieties normally make excellent wines. However, I did get a Pinot Grigio once from California which was very forgettable.

One big difference is that Juice Buckets are not concentrated much, if at all. I would guess that the addition of K-Meta and made very cold keeps the browning away.

 

[joeswine]

You are correct ROCKY; I think the world has had to adjust to the viniculture industry has hit some bad times in crop harvesting. What we're seeing is the blending of different co-ops with the same product or not but coming under one heading or style to fill orders.
Part of the reason I gave up on Juice buckets is the watery contents they started to have, lack of concentration, and flavor (that's just my opinion). the other facture was from freezing to thawing it just doesn't seem correct for the structure of the fruit, once's again just my thoughts.
The Reds have good structure, depending on what you do with them, great potential.
The Sangiovese and Shiraz I made turned out very good and they're still young.

 

[FredTheNuke]

FWK kit instructions question - aka solicit for fact based opinions.

I am following Matteo's kit instructions to the T. I have 6 kits in secondary and 5 in primary all going very well. I see a lot of folks are dead set on keeping the wine in the carboy for many months. The kit instructions state to rack at least 2 times with 2 weeks in between (that would put primary at 2 weeks, secondary at 6 weeks with 2 rackings so 8 weeks total). I intend to filter with #2 pads using a Buon Vino Super Jet. I plan to do that (and per kit instructions) when the wine has been in secondary with chitosan/kieselsol and clearing for 2 weeks.

What is the down side of this plan as experienced by the Team?

If I move ahead with bottling that early I will be using Nomacorc 1.5" #9s and aging in a temperature controlled wine cooler (52F for whites and 56F for reds).

PS - I snagged an All In One Wine Pump for the bottling - I'm looking forward to how it will make it much easier!

 

[winemaker81]

What is the down side of this plan as experienced by the Team?

AFAIK, there is no downside to following the instructions. IME the FWK instructions are the best I've seen. The wine will turn out fine.

However, don't be in a hurry to bottle. The instructions are written to both satisfy a market need (beginners start wine today and want to drink it tomorrow), and those who have developed the necessary patience to let wine age to its real potential.

You can bottle the wine in 8 weeks and the result will be something you'll rightfully be proud of.

However, re-read the instructions -- the Forte kit instructions say to wait at least 2 weeks between rackings. After fermentation, all durations are minimum values. If you want to produce better wine, give the wine more time. Whites benefit from 4 to 6 months before bottling, reds 6 to 12 months.

You have 11 kits in process. Bottle 2 on kit schedule, a white (if you have one) and a red with the the fewest skin packs. These will be your early drinkers.

Let the others age in bulk longer.

Open a bottle every 2 to 3 months and write down your impressions. Do this at every tasting, but do not look at previous notes. At the 12 month mark, read the notes from first to last. This will teach you about how wines age and you will learn that the "let it age" advice is good.

I use the Select 900 Nomacorcs (1.5") and have been pleased with them. They are supposed to be rated for 5 years, and I expect to get at least 7 years from them.