WineXpert Question about LE Australia Grenache and Cab with Grape Skin

[Trick]

Hi I just bought the big kit. Surprisingly, it comes with two packets of yeast, one is 71B-1112 and one is EC-1118. Does anyone have any idea what is the purpose for these two different yeasts. The instruction just asks to sprinkle yeast(s) onto fermenter. Is is appropriate to add different yeast together?
I have BM4x4 handy, can I use that to substitute EC-1118?
Maybe 71B is for malolactic acid reduction? If this is the case, that would be an interesting way to conduct a kind semi-MLF (without using MLF bacteria), which is usually discouraged for kit wine making. It is typically used for fruit and rose wine as far as I know.
Thanks in advance.

 

[Ajmassa]

My WE Bravado came with 2 yeasts. EV 1118 and BM 4x4 if I remember correctly. Expensive and also had skins.
Not 100% on this, but I think it's just a failsafe. Because both yeasts will not work together. And the stronger one will win out and take over the ferment. Maybe they're just hedging their bets and making sure the job gets done for their higher end kits?

Edit: I just checked my notes and it was EC-1118 and RC-212

 

[Trick]

My WE Bravado came with 2 yeasts. EV 1118 and BM 4x4 if I remember correctly. Expensive and also had skins.
Not 100% on this, but I think it's just a failsafe. Because both yeasts will not work together. And the stronger one will win out and take over the ferment. Maybe they're just hedging their bets and making sure the job gets done for their higher end kits?

Thx for the response. Sound like the multiple yeast in the kit was not a mistake. Since 1118 is more aggressive than 71b. So I am thinking pitching the 71b first and let it happy for a couple of days with large population developed first and then pitching the monster to take care of the tough leftover. Hope this can work better.

 

[Ajmassa]

Sounds like a great idea. I pitched both at the same time and let em duke it out. Had a nice strong ferment in spite of the cold northeast January weather. Did my best to keep the temps near 70°.

 

[pillswoj]

Thats what I am doing, pitched the 71b last night and will pitch the 1118 later in the week

 

[Trick]

Thats what I am doing, pitched the 71b last night and will pitch the 1118 later in the week

Nice. I will try that way for sure.
71b for full body red is still weird for me. Anything I can think of in this case is its de-malolactic acid capacity.
Yeah, the mixed yeast practice overturned by original concept of yeast pitching, which is typically done by one yeast and then blend if second one is used. If it works well, I will apply it more often.
Thanks for reply the thread.
Still doing something research on cold soak and extended maceration with skin. Thinking about incorporating one the those into schedule.
Fun to play skin kit.

 

[Boatboy24]

Most kits are balanced with malic acid and have large amounts of it, so it is interesting that 71B is included.

 

[DG2001]

I'm getting close to starting my kit and was planning on using MT yeast. I would like some feedback on whether y'all think I should proceed with the MT only or use the 71B along with the MT. I've only used 71B once and it was with the 2017 Passport Riesling and had good results but seems odd using it with a "Big Red"

 

[pillswoj]

Maybe its to try and pull more of the fruit notes out of the Grenache. Mine was working away quite well this morning, will probably pitch the 1118 tomorrow night.

 

[Trick]

I'm getting close to starting my kit and was planning on using MT yeast. I would like some feedback on whether y'all think I should proceed with the MT only or use the 71B along with the MT. I've only used 71B once and it was with the 2017 Passport Riesling and had good results but seems odd using it with a "Big Red"

I am hesitating the same thing. Maybe I should try BM4x4 with 71b and leave 1118 as the lifesaver if for some reason the fermentation is stuck.

 

[Trick]

Maybe its to try and pull more of the fruit notes out of the Grenache. Mine was working away quite well this morning, will probably pitch the 1118 tomorrow night.

Yeah. It makes sense.

 

[Cellar_Dweller]

I am hesitating the same thing. Maybe I should try BM4x4 with 71b and leave 1118 as the lifesaver if for some reason the fermentation is stuck.

This is pretty much what I did. I used two packets of BM4x4 initially, and then pitched one packet of the included 1118 at 1.015 to help ensure complete fermentation. I also added 1 tsp of nutrient about half way through. It was at 0.996 last night, and there was still some activity in the primary. I will never know if the BM4x4 would have gotten there alone, but I've had a couple of kits kind of hang at just "off-dry", and I didn't want to go through that again. Smelled wonderful during ferment, and tastes good. Very grenachie (sp).

 

[Trick]

This is pretty much what I did. I used two packets of BM4x4 initially, and then pitched one packet of the included 1118 at 1.015 to help ensure complete fermentation. I also added 1 tsp of nutrient about half way through. It was at 0.996 last night, and there was still some activity in the primary. I will never know if the BM4x4 would have gotten there alone, but I've had a couple of kits kind of hang at just "off-dry", and I didn't want to go through that again. Smelled wonderful during ferment, and tastes good. Very grenachie (sp).

Sounds very encouraging. I would pitch 1118 at secondary to finish last bit of sugar. For primary, I will try both 71b and bm4x4 to see what happens.
Yeah, nutrient is important for BM4x4. Thx for reminding.
The grape skin is now in my freezer to break the cell. Thinking about "Cold soak" with pectic enzyme for a couple of days before pitching. Extraction is all the focus. not sure what will happen eventually. Too astringent to drink? Maybe. Anyway, I am not expect to try this before next year. It is fun to tweak.

 

[Brian55]

Ours is rolling along quite nicely with just the 71b.

 

[Brian55]

Ours is rolling along quite nicely with just the 71b.

Down to 1.020 today, day 3, temp has been ~72. Contemplating if or when I should add the EC1118. Opinions?

 

[pillswoj]

I have not checked sg yet but based on activity ( definitely slowing down)I am adding the 1118 tonight

 

[Smok1]

Your lucky, i was waiting in line to get the gren cab, sold out right away, i got the Blanc de Noir i really wanted and i picked up the Cab Franc since i didnt get the Gren Cab. Im jelouse.

 

[Trick]

Down to 1.020 today, day 3, temp has been ~72. Contemplating if or when I should add the EC1118. Opinions?

I have tried 71b in a couple of ciders. Every time it stopped right after racking into carboy, even when expected ABV is below 12%. Not sure exactly why. Maybe due to environment change? Or maybe that is why it is recommended for OFF-DRY white?
Anyway, 1.012 should be a good time to pitch 1118 to allow the beast to finish the rest. For the harsh environment, it would be nice to make the yeast starter by adding must little by little to the yeast.
Another option is to wait for the 71b to finish as mush as it can to 1.010 and pitch 1118 in carboy.
Just some thoughts.

 

[Trick]

Your lucky, i was waiting in line to get the gren cab, sold out right away, i got the Blanc de Noir i really wanted and i picked up the Cab Franc since i didnt get the Gren Cab. Im jelouse.

I got this from a local store. My target was to get a World Vineyard Australian Cab with skin, a cheaper version to do play some tweaks. But it was out of stock and the store guy recommended this to me and the price makes me hesitate for tweaking.

 

[deneed4spd]

First wine kit ever. Racked into secondary after 7 days. Initial tastes out of primary was pretty sweet wine still. The fermenting is still moving along slowly. Going to check 5 days from now to see if it is done fermenting and potentially rack/degass. Used both packs of yeast right away and it was bubbling along pretty strong for 6 days.