Other Tweeking Cheap Kits

[GretchenR]

@GretchenR
I used the recipe you listed using blackberries, and also a cheap Malbec with Zante currants--both to 5 gallons. These are two of my favorite "easy drinkers." Sadly I'm almost out of both so have two more in the works where I'm experimenting with making full 6 gallons for comparison. Other changes I kept the same. Can't wait until they're ready.

Thanks for your response. Your earlier posts were part of my source material, so thanks for that also. Have you ever tried using a different yeast, either alone or in combination with EC1118? Red Star Premier Rouge and RC212 are both reputed to enhance the flavor of red wine but I don't know how fussy they are.

 

[Khristyjeff]

For the cheap kits I've stayed with the ec1118 that is included. On my real grapes (frozen grape musts), juice buckets, and fruit wines I've just started experimenting with different yeasts. I've used D254, Red Star Premier Rouge, and for a cab Sauvignon I had two buckets so used BM4x4 in one and RC212 in the other, then combined once fermentation was complete. Very young now, but even at this stage, after sampling, I will use all of these yeast strains again.
That being said, I'd recommend followed MoreWine's suggested protocol for using a yeast starter and adding nutrients at a couple different times. Prior to this last time, I'd wait until I smelled a slight rotten egg smell then add nutrients. Not good. These require (at minimum benefit from) nutrients.

 

[winemaker81]

Have you ever tried using a different yeast, either alone or in combination with EC1118? Red Star Premier Rouge and RC212 are both reputed to enhance the flavor of red wine but I don't know how fussy they are.

Kit vendors use EC-1118 because it's a non-fussy workhorse that has the best likelihood of producing a good result for a beginner with no experienced help. You can get good results by using a different yeast, saving the EC-1118 for problem ferments. I'm not sold on mixing yeasts, as it appears that one is more likely to dominate the other. A common strategy in commercial winemaking is to ferment different batches with different yeasts, and blend post-fermentation.

Before using a yeast, read the description. As @Khristyjeff noted, if it needs nutrient, add it. I don't recommend waiting until you smell rotten eggs -- H2S is NOT something to play with.

I've been using the FWK protocol since last summer -- When preparing the must, determine the amount of nutrient needed and add 2/3 of it.

Make an overnight starter with 1 cup warm water (90-95 F), 1 packet of yeast, 1 tsp nutrient, and 1 tsp sugar. Put in a sanitized wine bottle and swirl to mix. I leave it on the counter for 4 to 6 hours, then put it with the must overnight, so the temperature acclimates to the fermentation area. In the morning, swirl the starter and gently pour down the side of the fermenter so it doesn't spread. Don't stir for 24 hours.

48 hours after inoculating, add the remaining 1/3 nutrient. There are numerous timings for adding nutrient -- this one works well so I recommend it.

 

[GretchenR]

Kit vendors use EC-1118 because it's a non-fussy workhorse that has the best likelihood of producing a good result for a beginner with no experienced help. You can get good results by using a different yeast, saving the EC-1118 for problem ferments. I'm not sold on mixing yeasts, as it appears that one is more likely to dominate the other. A common strategy in commercial winemaking is to ferment different batches with different yeasts, and blend post-fermentation.

Before using a yeast, read the description. As @Khristyjeff noted, if it needs nutrient, add it. I don't recommend waiting until you smell rotten eggs -- H2S is NOT something to play with.

I've been using the FWK protocol since last summer -- When preparing the must, determine the amount of nutrient needed and add 2/3 of it.

Make an overnight starter with 1 cup warm water (90-95 F), 1 packet of yeast, 1 tsp nutrient, and 1 tsp sugar. Put in a sanitized wine bottle and swirl to mix. I leave it on the counter for 4 to 6 hours, then put it with the must overnight, so the temperature acclimates to the fermentation area. In the morning, swirl the starter and gently pour down the side of the fermenter so it doesn't spread. Don't stir for 24 hours.

48 hours after inoculating, add the remaining 1/3 nutrient. There are numerous timings for adding nutrient -- this one works well so I recommend it.

My thanks to you and to Khristyjeff for this great information. Just to make sure I understand about the nutrient, say I need 5 tsp of nutrient for my 5 gallons. Do I add 2 tsp to the must before inoculation and 1 tsp to the yeast starter, and the remaining 2 tsp after 48 hours? That keeps the 2/3 to 1/3 ratio (in rough numbers). I apologize if I'm getting too fussy here. I promise I'll relax after I've had a few successes with these cheap kits.

 

[winemaker81]

My thanks to you and to Khristyjeff for this great information. Just to make sure I understand about the nutrient, say I need 5 tsp of nutrient for my 5 gallons. Do I add 2 tsp to the must before inoculation and 1 tsp to the yeast starter, and the remaining 2 tsp after 48 hours? That keeps the 2/3 to 1/3 ratio (in rough numbers). I apologize if I'm getting too fussy here. I promise I'll relax after I've had a few successes with these cheap kits.

I probably go a bit high on the nutrient, as I haven't counted what goes in the starter. Don't be shy about asking questions -- easier to set you on a good path than to fix a problem.

 

[joeswine]

Let your wines description be your guide ( the break down of taste profile) and your hydrometer your best friend you can’t go wrong using basic techniques, same goes with yeast look for soft yeast for light whites and fruit forward reds , ev1118 is a workhorse , read and have fun with your wine that’s what it’s all about , having Fun and creativity , not just making it .
A good everyday wine was a staple throughout the world .

 

[Rocky]

Joe, I will take your advise on the Fontana Merlot kit. On this attempt, I will add 1 cup of currants, oak, and chapitalize.

any advice on what to do with the 1/2 gallon of blackberry purée on another kit?

Find a "cheap kit" Cabernet Sauvignon and add the blackberry puree to it. I routinely add blackberry to my CB's and it really brings out that background flavor.

 

[joeswine]

yes, it does rocky, it's part of its taste profile, (berries)

 

[joeswine]

Always keep in mind people were talking about making a tasty everyday wine, however, these technics can be applied to other higher kits as well, with planning .

 

[joeswine]

Always keep in mind people were talking about making a tasty everyday wine, however, these technics can be applied to other higher kits as well, with planning .

498k views and grows by a thousand views every 2 weeks, not bad for a cellared dweller

 

[joeswine]

Theses kits do not repeat do not need a yeast starter, there designed to start as directed , reguardless of the yeast you decide to use, only factor is temperature, that I know you already understand.
Kits Adler designed for simplicity,, not rock Science .if you look at and download red dtsrvyeast or any other yeast company yeast profile chart and pin it to the way , this way you can choose a. Yeast better designed for your wines taste profile or your one person taste preference , it’s your wine,,

 

[joeswine]

Yes adding different yeast is like using different spices to make the same sauce only with a twist.
First know your wines taste profile
Download a yeast chart or two is even better
Compare yeast pluses to your wines profile then choose, be creative , don’t be afraid to take a chance .
Using Red Star yeast usually the finish is smooth and bright I use champagne yeast all the tim for my whites as well as fruit forward reds , have fun ( think outside the box)

 

[Ohio Bob]

I totally agree. BTW, you inspired me with multiple yeasts, so this spring I started 4 Chilean juice buckets, all were split into 3 smaller buckets, all using different yeasts. Around day 4-5 when SG got to 1.010, I blended each varietal back together. I’ve only tasted it at day 4-5 (still sweet) and at day 30, so it’s hard to make firm statements, but this is something I’m going to be doing going forward. It’s perhaps a cheap way to tweak cheap kits as well as juice buckets, both seem to be lacking if I read the multiple posts correctly.

 

[joeswine]

Ya, it’s just grape juice have fun , yet your best friend is your hydrometer let that be your guide akways once the plan is set and you started your plan, akways gave fun

 

[joeswine]

Plan your work , then work your plan and akways let your hydrometer be your guide.
Have fun

 

[joeswine]

I've been making high-end kits for years. I'm intrigued by the idea of using cheap kits to make a decent daily drinker. My plan is to make two identical kits (On the House Merlot), one to mfr's instructions, one with tweaks, and then compare them. My plan after reading this thread (yes, I have read all 151 pages) is this recipe: Reduce water to 5 gallons, add EITHER 1 cup Zante currants OR a blackberry fpac made from 16 oz berries, Chaptalize to 1.10 SG, add one cup oak chips. In secondary add 1 tsp tannin.

Does anyone have a tried-and-true Merlot recipe they would like to recommend instead of the above? Also, what about using either RC212 or Red Star Premier Rouge yeast instead of the EC1118? I appreciate all suggestions.

There’s no tried or true , there’s let’s start with a base and take it from there

 

[joeswine]

499k and growing thanks to all for your input and questions

 

[JB005]

Good plan go for it
It's always a good idea to taste your Fpac. before your enter it into the mix.

Thanks for all your information on making Fpacs!

I'm planning on making an Fpac with crowberries - they're supposed to be high in tannins and will add it to the secondary. Should I add the Fpac after degassing and adding the other clarifying packets or add them to the secondary, let that sit for a week or two (or more?), rack the wine, then add the stabilizing and clarifying packs?

 

[joeswine]

That’s a plan , most fpac s are added to the primary so that the flavors are extracted there, you could add them in the secondary then they become a background flavor,
Never heard of those berries before??

 

[my wine]

I ordered an MV Cab Franc kit from Midwest Supplies with a 20% off promotion for Fathers Day. Northern Brewers has the discount also. (Only a couple days left on that deal if you're interested.) I should have it by Thursday. It's a 10 liter kit so I consider it one notch above a cheap kit. But I still plan on tweaking it a little. I have a bag of FWK grape skins used once already so it will go in for a 2nd run. Oak chips before and after.

I was also considering a cup of raisins or blackberries. Maybe some raspberries since that's in the profile also. My intent is to enhance the body and the tannins. Anyone have experience with cab franc or suggestions on tweaks? Or should I just let it go with the grape skins and oak only? Thanks!