Other Tweeking Cheap Kits

[joeswine]

You make a good point -- some high end commercial blends have as little as 3% of a wine added, which the winemaker believes makes a difference. That's roughly 1 bottle in 30, so topping a 23 liter carboy with 1 to 2 bottles of wine may change the original profile.

OTOH, do I care what the original profile was, as long as I produce something I'm pleased with?

It's a good question each of us needs to answer for ourselves.

That’s correct

 

[SteveM]

Here’s my thoughts on adding wines to top off your kit or homemade wine
Think about this for a , you’re creating a Pino Noir , from a WE KIT.
The kit concentrate already has a flavor the mfg. wants ( your not adding enhancements ) . Got it ?
Your adding a finished wine with its own says and means .
This could change the original intent of the wine kits taste just enough to throw it off .
When doing anything different to a kit or juice always ask your self does it conform t the original structure of the flavor profile in most cases ( YES).

You do make a great point. I can see this being the case if you add a cheap wine that doesn't taste all that great, but I have always added a "Like" wine that I actually like. So any change that may be affected by adding it, I have always had a good outcome. Maybe I've been lucky .

 

[winemaker81]

You do make a great point. I can see this being the case if you add a cheap wine that doesn't taste all that great, but I have always added a "Like" wine that I actually like. So any change that may be affected by adding it, I have always had a good outcome. Maybe I've been lucky .

I recall several sayings about how we make our own luck. Topping up with a wine that is as good (or better) than the one you're topping is a choice for success.

Topping with a lower quality wine may bring the overall quality of the batch down.

 

[Shurt1073]

I am thinking about splitting a batch of Blueberry Pinot Noir (a Sweet WinExpert Island Mist) and add 3 fresh Red Hot Chili Peppers to 3 Gallons and let it set 3-5 days... Anyone have an experience or thoughts on this?

I have added 3-4 whole peppercorns to several 6 gallon kits as it bulk ages in a glass carboy for 6+ months and it gives just enough hint of peppery notes. It seemed 1-2 peppercorns didn't do much but 3-4 is just right for me. I'm chicken to add more than 4 to 6 gallons of wine as I think I've found my sweet spot for the peppercorns.

 

[BernardSmith]

First time poster here. I've spent the last couple days reading through this thread, awesome amount of information.

I'm a first time wine kit maker. I've done several batches of fruit wine, blueberry, blackberry and mixed fruit batches. That said, I've done it all with my 85 grandfather in-law, and although we've made good wine, I'm still not confident on the science and process. We keep it real simple with him, fruit-sugar-yeast-time. Old recipes passed down over time. I'm trying to understand SG, degassing, clarifying, ect. If anyone has suggestions or places to read further on that, I'm all ears.

I've bought a Costco Argentina Ridge Pinot Noir kit, the double kit. From what I've read, the suggestions are to reduce these to 5gal each. I only have access to 6 gallon carboys for now, i'm worried about that much open space. Would I be better to keep them full, and add some extra f-packs or sugar? Planning on adding flavor packs, I'm thinking blackberry to one, blueberry to the other. Maybe some tannins in the primary.

SG, I'm thinking to shoot for 1.09 to start, maybe 0.998 to end?

Other than that, should I just follow the timing and chemical steps as outlined in the kit?

Sorry if this is a lot of questions, as I said, still working to wrap my head around this. Open to all suggestions and advice.

Here's the thing. You say you have access to only 6 gallon carboys at the moment. Even if the kit was designed to make 5 gallons, having a 6 gallon carboy as your primary is never a problem. Headroom, the space above the wine in a fermenter is only an issue AFTER active fermentation has ended. At that time, the yeast have stopped pumping out CO2 and that space is filled with air. Air - oxygen - at that time will begin to degrade the color and flavors of the wine. It's akin to rust. During active fermentation - while the yeast is producing carbon dioxide (and alcohol) that CO2 acts to blanket the wine and prevent it from oxidizing. Moreover, certainly in the first week or so of fermentation, the yeast takes up oxygen as it reproduces.

But note, even a five gallon carboy is larger than 5 gallons. In my opinion, the best approach is always to aim to fill the secondary fermenter right up into the neck. That might mean using a smaller carboy than the volume you are beginning with and using other vessels to hold the "excess". Because a) all other things being equal, simply adding more water or f-packs will change the balance of the wine - diluting the potential ABV if its water or increasing the ABV if you are adding f-packs. And wine is fundamentally, all about balance. b), if you use glass marbles or sealed bags filled with water to displace the wine and so fill the carboy, you may find that you need a lot of marbles and sealed bags CAN leak.

 

[joeswine]

You do make a great point. I can see this being the case if you add a cheap wine that doesn't taste all that great, but I have always added a "Like" wine that I actually like. So any change that may be affected by adding it, I have always had a good outcome. Maybe I've been lucky .

Actually your adding a different wine and it’s not the same , so it does make a difference imop

 

[Pstan58]

Lemons are and can be tart.
Limes , not recommended not a wine background enhancement.
The grapefruit doesn’t add taste it add an acidity ( clean bit ) to the back end.
Also I’ve have this wine and it’s spot on , thanks for following

Joe well the experiment continues! I tried the lemon zest on the first batch and it was very faint. I also shorted the water to be added which was 1 gal and 5 gal of juice. That test was a bomb. I thought about it before dumping it and added in 1 gal of water at the second racking. It improved alot! I also added 1/3 of a grapefruit zest to this batch. What the heck it was a low cost practice batch.
Also I started a new batch of the same kit to see if a variation would be better. I made the batch with the full 6 gallons and added 2/3 of a grapefruit in zest no juice at the primary. I used a red star premier Cuvee yeast as the kits yeast was old. Waited till the wine fermented dry. Then transfer to the secondary for clarifying. After a week I tasted both side by side. I found that the 1/3 grapefruit back note on the first batch was better than the one with 2/3 in the primary. Odd I thought. I actually liked the first batch better.
So I asked six friends to try the batches blind all seemed to like batch one better. So the batches will remain as they are. I think the first will remain as is and be bottled. The second batch will be used for a peach, lichee and strawberry infusion. these will be seperate 1 gallon test runs, preparing for a summer tie deck wine. I think the extraction of the zest faltered in the fact that was a 6 gallon batch rather than a 5 gallon and I would need to up the zest due to the volume. By the way all of the wines from these kits came out a light honey color but absolutely clear.

Thanks again Joe

 

[Pstan58]

Has anyone had any experience with the 60-750ml bottles Argentia Ridge Chateau Private Selection Cabernet Sauvignon Wine Making Kit
from Costco online? I had thought that since the kit weights in at 11.8 gallons finished (2 - 6 liter juice bags) I could may by squeeze it at 9 gal for a more full bodied wine. This would reduce my bottle count to about 46. I would also be adding zane currents as a flavor pack to simulate the skins. The price is stupid cheap for what you get at $90.. The only thing I dont know is the concentration level of the juice bags and the resulting ABV upon dilution as Ide like to stay at 1.085ABV finish at 0.990ish using water to arrive at my goal of 1.085ish. Im thinking that the juice concentrate might be too thick and have too high of a brix. Although isnt this the experimentation that this group is founded on thinking outside the box?

 

[Pstan58]

My answer to your questions is a question: What do you want?

Adding grape skins, raisins, or Zante currants will add body. Adding fruit will alter flavor and probably add body. Doing both is a good experiment. Indulge yourself.

I am NOT a fan of cooking fruit for winemaking, as it alters the flavor. Your call on that.

You're making a CS? Add chips prior to fermentation to provide sacrificial tannin (preserves grape tannin) and stabilizes color. Buy oak cubes to add for aging oak, 1 to 1.5 oz per batch.

Bulk age at least 6 months, and leave the oak cubes in the full duration.

Chaptalization? That depends on what you want. Yeah, I'm good at saying that, right? But it's correct. *I* like heavy CS, so I'd bump the OG to 1.100. For a lighter red I want an OG of 1.085 to 1.095. There's no right or wrong, it's what you like.

I add glycerin at bottling time.

great tip going to do the same kit next week

 

[joeswine]

Has anyone had any experience with the 60-750ml bottles Argentia Ridge Chateau Private Selection Cabernet Sauvignon Wine Making Kit
from Costco online? I had thought that since the kit weights in at 11.8 gallons finished (2 - 6 liter juice bags) I could may by squeeze it at 9 gal for a more full bodied wine. This would reduce my bottle count to about 46. I would also be adding zane currents as a flavor pack to simulate the skins. The price is stupid cheap for what you get at $90.. The only thing I dont know is the concentration level of the juice bags and the resulting ABV upon dilution as Ide like to stay at 1.085ABV finish at 0.990ish using water to arrive at my goal of 1.085ish. Im thinking that the juice concentrate might be too thick and have too high of a brix. Although isnt this the experimentation that this group is founded on thinking outside the box?

You always have to let your hydrometer be your guide in this venture.
After fermentation it takes acetate wine 4 to 6 weeks to really settle out , new wine can be very funny in the beginning and yet decent after a while ( not long ).
As far as zest goes , half a grapefruit is usually good enough, if it’s light after the wait period , you can always add more.
Also not all kits are created equal , even cheaper kits of the same vendor.

 

[joeswine]

When doing tweaks , always know what your wines base ( profile ).
At that point you can. FIRST . Have a plan. Just don’t dump , always remember less cis more , 16 ozs of fruit is enough in the primary.
Secondary the same .
Most of all don’t try and over think it ?
It’s wine making, keep it fun not Rocket Science

 

[SteveM]

She minds like a plan just remember my old saying ( less is more ) on the peppers. You can always add

It turned out really good! I couldn't find any Cayenne Peppers but I did find some Red Hot Chili Peppers and threw those in (about 10). I learned some lessons along the way but after about 3 weeks, it turned out amazing.
It has just the right amount of Sweet and Heat. Another really nice things is it doesn't have any lingering heat which makes it easy to drink and leave you wanting more.
The Label was created with the help of Google's AI, Gemini. I told it my idea and it gave me a rough label that I was able to bring in and modify myself to give me what you see below.
Yes I know... "Red, Hot & Blue" is a BBQ joint. But I also think it's a great name for this Blueberry Pinot Noir infused with Red Hot Chili Peppers

 

[joeswine]

Excellent labels

 

[Fencepost]

Has anyone had any experience with the 60-750ml bottles Argentia Ridge Chateau Private Selection Cabernet Sauvignon Wine Making Kit
from Costco online? I had thought that since the kit weights in at 11.8 gallons finished (2 - 6 liter juice bags) I could may by squeeze it at 9 gal for a more full bodied wine. This would reduce my bottle count to about 46. I would also be adding zane currents as a flavor pack to simulate the skins. The price is stupid cheap for what you get at $90.. The only thing I dont know is the concentration level of the juice bags and the resulting ABV upon dilution as Ide like to stay at 1.085ABV finish at 0.990ish using water to arrive at my goal of 1.085ish. Im thinking that the juice concentrate might be too thick and have too high of a brix. Although isnt this the experimentation that this group is founded on thinking outside the box?

FWIW, the SG on this exact kit for one of the 6 gallon batches was 1.090, I was thinking along your lines but with guidance from this forum, I will just make two separate batches and tweak each individually. btw, the pH was 3.61. First batch I tweaked with raisins, glycerin and a blackberry fpac. Yet to do the second kit. Tasted good on racking, should be good enough for a table wine.

 

[Gilmango]

items on the menu , 3 for my clients, and the. WE for me going to add a great fpac for this on , love Dosnish wines .
Grape kits , a little grapefruit zest for the Pino. And a standard wine on the red

Curious about that Bobal / Cabernet limited edition wine from WE, sort of wish it was single varietal Bobal as that is so rare. Have you sampled it yet and, if so, what are your impressions?

 

[joeswine]

Curious about that Bobal / Cabernet limited edition wine from WE, sort of wish it was single varietal Bobal as that is so rare. Have you sampled it yet and, if so, what are your impressions?

I’ll be bottling this very soon. And will give you my brake down, ok?

 

[Jrose92]

So I've got both of my Costco Pinot Noir kits going right now. The first I did by the book, following the instructions. The second kit leaked a bit, so I added a F-pack, blackberry and saskatoon, to get the SG to where it needed to be.

One issue that I've had, is that both kits have been going to fast. I think its due to the room being quite warm. The first reached its target SG in the primary in 5 days instead of 10. The second kit also went to fast, and I didn't catch it in time. I was supposed to rack into the secondary at 1.010, but I caught it at 0.996. The target final SG is 0.995.

Seeing as it got most of the way there in the primary, would it make sense to drastically shorten the time in the secondary? I think it will reach its target SG in only a couple days, so should I de-gas and add stabilizers then? Or let it sit in the secondary for a bit longer, and potentially dry out even more?

 

[Ohio Bob]

would it make sense to drastically shorten the time in the secondary? I think it will reach its target SG in only a couple days, so should I de-gas and add stabilizers then? Or let it sit in the secondary for a bit longer, and potentially dry out even more?

Drastically? No. Yeast has its own time table, whether it’s 5 days or 10 is not critical. I would put under airlock for another 2 weeks, then degas and add stabilizers. It wouldn’t be wrong to do it immediately either, it will eventually ferment dry.

 

[joeswine]

Well heres why I do .
Primarily fermentation in buckets then just short of finishing I transfer to 6 gallon carboys even if it has head space .2 weeks there to help settle out and finish fermentation .
Now here’s the trick.
After 2weeks you can either add your clearing chemistry or transfer to the proper size carboy .
Or wait 2 more weeks and bottle to be sure .
Always let your hydrometer be your guide, it’s not rocket science have fun with this craft.

 

[joeswine]

Yesterday I bottled my Spanish Cabernet
Did a tasting I’m impressed, of course I added my enhancements, grape kin pack , tannins in the primary and oak and tannins in the secondary , great structure and it’s young .
Oh well we’ ll move on to the ne t one