Blackberries, black raspberries and other similar

[Jovimaple]

My LHBS says this on their website: "Lalvin 71B is a low foaming strain that is a very rapid starter" - Lalvin 71B Wine Yeast

I haven't used that yeast yet, so I don't have any personal experience as far as whether it foams a lot.

If you used a whole packet of yeast for a 1 gallon batch, and you had a yeast starter, then those yeastie beasties had a huge colony and were raring to go and probably just burned through the sugar really quickly.

If you get the same reading with your friend's hydrometer, then go ahead and rack and get it under airlock. At this first racking after fermentation is complete, I add kmeta, which in your case would probably be 1 crushed campden tablet (it's easier than trying to measure out the amount of powdered kmeta). Then let it sit for a couple of weeks for the gross lees to fall out. (If I rack before fermentation is complete, I skip the kmeta until it's done fermenting.)

In 2 to 3 weeks, when you rack off the gross lees, make sure to degas the wine. I did a few 1 gallon wine kits and the directions said to cover the end of the jug with your sanitized hand and shake the jug a bit to get the degassing started. You can also stir it up either by hand or with a drill stirrer for a minute or so. Once you're done stirring, add the airlock.

Jumpstarting the degassing process will help it to clear faster, too.

When it's aging, add kmeta (1 crushed campden tablet for 1 gallon) about every 3 months. If you decide to backsweeten before about 9 months, make sure to also add potassium sorbate to prevent refermentation, before adding the sugar. While rare, there could still be yeastie beasties alive after 9 months, so if you don't use sorbate before backsweetening, I would recommend waiting a few days before bottling to make sure you don't get renewed fermentation.

I have a peach that has been aging now for close to 9 months. I do want to backsweeten it, so I need to decide if I'm going to trust that 9 months is long enough or wait until a full year before backsweetening. I have always used sorbate so this is the first time I'm trying the time method instead.

 

[Newbie Mel]

My LHBS says this on their website: "Lalvin 71B is a low foaming strain that is a very rapid starter" - Lalvin 71B Wine Yeast

I haven't used that yeast yet, so I don't have any personal experience as far as whether it foams a lot.

If you used a whole packet of yeast for a 1 gallon batch, and you had a yeast starter, then those yeastie beasties had a huge colony and were raring to go and probably just burned through the sugar really quickly.

If you get the same reading with your friend's hydrometer, then go ahead and rack and get it under airlock. At this first racking after fermentation is complete, I add kmeta, which in your case would probably be 1 crushed campden tablet (it's easier than trying to measure out the amount of powdered kmeta). Then let it sit for a couple of weeks for the gross lees to fall out. (If I rack before fermentation is complete, I skip the kmeta until it's done fermenting.)

In 2 to 3 weeks, when you rack off the gross lees, make sure to degas the wine. I did a few 1 gallon wine kits and the directions said to cover the end of the jug with your sanitized hand and shake the jug a bit to get the degassing started. You can also stir it up either by hand or with a drill stirrer for a minute or so. Once you're done stirring, add the airlock.

Jumpstarting the degassing process will help it to clear faster, too.

When it's aging, add kmeta (1 crushed campden tablet for 1 gallon) about every 3 months. If you decide to backsweeten before about 9 months, make sure to also add potassium sorbate to prevent refermentation, before adding the sugar. While rare, there could still be yeastie beasties alive after 9 months, so if you don't use sorbate before backsweetening, I would recommend waiting a few days before bottling to make sure you don't get renewed fermentation.

I have a peach that has been aging now for close to 9 months. I do want to backsweeten it, so I need to decide if I'm going to trust that 9 months is long enough or wait until a full year before backsweetening. I have always used sorbate so this is the first time I'm trying the time method instead.

Thank you!!!!

 

[winemaker81]

Yes one gallon batch. OG 1.090. Lalvin 71B and yes used yeast starter.

You used a packet capable of starting 19-23 liters on a 4 liter batch -- this means the initial colony was 5 times larger than normal in comparison to the must size. It's not a surprise that you achieved such a rapid ferment.

I agree with Joni, no reason to worry. If you smelled H2S, then you have a problem, but I assume not. H2S smells like swamp gas or dog farts -- if you have the misfortune to smell it, it's unmistakable and you'll never forget it, no matter how much you try.

Don't worry about the SG -- it's almost certain your wine is fine. Proceed as if the ferment was a more common duration.

 

[Newbie Mel]

Got it racked to secondary. It tastes good, but has lot of clearing to do. Got a gallon and half, hoping for gallon when all said and done.

Next question, can I save this jar for a starter for another batch? I’m thinking of doing a blackberry mead with the rest of my berries. Wondering if it fermented to .990 will the leftover still be viable for a starter? And can I put it in refrigerator for a few days before I get to next batch? Any concern it will explode in a closed jar?

 

[Newbie Mel]

Oh, another question. When doing small one gallon batches in the future, should I skip a starter? Like is too yeast and a fast ferment going to affect the taste in a bad way?

 

[Raptor99]

Oh, another question. When doing small one gallon batches in the future, should I skip a starter? Like is too yeast and a fast ferment going to affect the taste in a bad way?

You could use the leftover sludge to start a new batch, if the ferment is healthy and there are not off odors or flavors. Taste the lees to see if you can detect anything that is off. If it tastes good, it is probably healthy. There should be plenty of yeast to start a new batch.

For a 1-gallon batch, you could re-hydrate the yeast with Go-Ferm and then just add it to the must.

 

[winemaker81]

Any concern it will explode in a closed jar?

NEVER put an active ferment or degassing wine in an unrated, sealed container. You can make a grenade.

"Unrated" in this context means a container that is not rated to handle pressure. With rated containers, you need to know the pressure limit to avoid exceeding it.

 

[Raptor99]

And can I put it in refrigerator for a few days before I get to next batch? Any concern it will explode in a closed jar?

If you are talking about keeping some of the lees in the fridge for a few days, you can probably put it in a closed jar. But it is best to leave the lid on loosely and open it a few times a day to "burp" it. Fermentation will continue in the fridge, but it will slow down.

My preferred method for storing lees in the fridge is to put them in a wine bottle sealed with a Vacu Vin stopper like this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IZ882W2 That has the advantage of keeping it sealed and degassing, but not creating any problems if it puts out more CO2 than you expect.

However you store the lees, be sure to sanitize everything that touches them.

 

[Newbie Mel]

Damn I still have a lot to learn. I loosened the lid and will watch it. If I don’t get to it in a few days I’ll toss it. Not really seeing the point of keeping the sludge. I had no problem getting the yeast started using a yeast starter of water, GoFerm, a packet of yeast and a little sugar. What would be the point in starting with sludge?

 

[winemaker81]

Damn I still have a lot to learn. I loosened the lid and will watch it. If I don’t get to it in a few days I’ll toss it. Not really seeing the point of keeping the sludge. I had no problem getting the yeast started using a yeast starter of water, GoFerm, a packet of yeast and a little sugar. What would be the point in starting with sludge?

You will never stop learning. There's always something new ...

I start with fresh yeast every time, as it helps guarantee a successful result.

 

[BigDaveK]

Next question, can I save this jar for a starter for another batch? I’m thinking of doing a blackberry mead with the rest of my berries. Wondering if it fermented to .990 will the leftover still be viable for a starter? And can I put it in refrigerator for a few days before I get to next batch? Any concern it will explode in a closed jar?

My 2 cents...
I was curious about the same thing last year. I transfer to secondary around 1.020 and I started another wine with the gross lees and no other yeast. It was going like gangbusters in just a couple hours. I have no experience with refrigerating the gross lees.

Great thing about this hobby is that there are multiple ways to do the same thing. Try a few and stick with what you're comfortable with. I've never done a yeast starter. Warm water, bit o' sugar, the yeast is foaming in 15 minutes or less and I'm ready to go.

 

[Raptor99]

You don't need to keep the lees (sludge). Yeast is cheap, and you can start with new yeast every time.Some people like to experiment with keeping the lees to start a new batch. It is a ready-made starter. For a hard to start batch, the extra millions of yeast cells in the lees can help.

I have experimented with making smoothies from the lees. I add a little simple syrup and cream in my glass. The lees of some fruit wines can be quite tasty that way.

EDIT: You should only use the lees as a starter if they are from a healthy ferment with no off odors or flavors of any kind.

 

[BigDaveK]

@Newbie Mel this might sound crazy but taste the lees. Some are quite good.
I've added it to yogurt, making a smoothie like @Raptor99.
I've made jam that was really good! Some day I'll try a pie.
I added lees from pepper wines to chili and stew.
I've read it makes a good marinade and can also be used to make bread. Some day.
And I'm wondering about a fruit leather with my dehydrator.
Seems like it's a good resource but usually I add it to the compost pile

 

[Raptor99]

Many people take brewer's yeast supplements. The lees contain dead yeast cells, so they are rich in B vitamins. Think of it as a health food smoothie, with a little bit of alcohol. At this point I rarely dump out the gross lees. Usually I add sugar and half-and-half, and enjoy it as an after dinner drink. I think that it might make good sorbet, but I haven't tried that yet.

If the lees taste bad, it is probably because the ferment was not healthy and the yeast produced H2S or other off-flavors. Tasting the lees is the best test that I know of to determine whether you have succeeded in getting a healthy ferment.

I tried giving the fruit pulp (from the pulp bag) to the chickens, but they got drunk. So we have to be careful not to give them too much. Their little bodies can't handle much alcohol.

 

[Clover]

Damn I still have a lot to learn. I loosened the lid and will watch it. If I don’t get to it in a few days I’ll toss it. Not really seeing the point of keeping the sludge. I had no problem getting the yeast started using a yeast starter of water, GoFerm, a packet of yeast and a little sugar. What would be the point in starting with sludge?

I've used blackberry slurry to start a 1 gal Skeeter Pee. Made a delicious wine that has been very popular and requested by my friends. In fact, I have a blackberry fermenting right now, and will put the slurry in the fridge for a week or so - we are going away for the weekend - and start a batch of Skeeter with it as soon as I get a chance. I've often kept slurry in my fridge for more than two weeks and ferment just fine - I put it in a sanitized bowl and cover it with plastic wrap and a rubber band to keep the blasted fruit flies out.

 

[Raptor99]

I've used blackberry slurry to start a 1 gal Skeeter Pee.

The original Skeeter Pee recipe calls for using the lees from a previous batch of wine as a starter. The reason for that is that Real Lemon juice contains preservatives, so you need a really robust yeast culture to overcome that and start fermentation.

 

[Clover]

The original Skeeter Pee recipe calls for using the lees from a previous batch of wine as a starter. The reason for that is that Real Lemon juice contains preservatives, so you need a really robust yeast culture to overcome that and start fermentation.

Yep - and in a 1 gal batch, instead of the 5 gal the original recipe is created for, it ferments like gangbusters. Plus, I get the actual flavor from the fruit wine slurry with a lemon flavor from the lemon juice instead of what I expect is a hint of fruit wine flavor in a larger batch.

I've also made skeeter from Volcano lemon juice. That's a game changer, makes a delicious lemon wine. Much better quality juice than Real Lemon, although I still use Real Lemon when making skeeter with a fruit slurry as the fruit flavor adds to the quality of the finished wine. I don't like plain old skeeter with Real Lemon, especially not after using Volcano for a skeeter.

 

[Newbie Mel]

@Newbie Mel This video shows how to use it, just to make sure your technique is good. The receiving vessel always needs to be lower than the other, because gravity is necessary for this to work.



Also, I am a big fan of dreaming about wine making space!

I do a lot of mine in the kitchen. I mostly use 3 gallon carboys, and I split 6 gallon batches to fit. I also have a bunch of 1 gallon carboys, some 13 cup Mogan David wine jugs that fit the same #6 stopper as 1 gallon carboys, and finally, I use universal bungs turned upside down and use an airlock with 1.5 liter, 750 ml, and 375 ml bottles. So if I don't quite have 6 gallons and don't want to top off with a similar wine, I will rack down to a 3 gallon carboy and split the rest among smaller containers. I do have some 5 gallon carboys, but I can't lift those when they are full, so they stay in the laundry room where I age everything.

But .... we do have a space in the basement that we were planning to build out as a bar area with a sink. Then we realized there's not enough room to have the kind of bar with a counter and barstools. So the plans have shifted to making it my winery area instead, eventually. Until we win the lottery, and then we will add onto the house so that the basement will be expanded and I can have lots of room to make wine and age it!

Ok I figured out it is user error with the auto siphon. I did order a new one with the clamp. First one I received was cracked so returned for replacement. Tried my old mini on today using the clamp. My error was that I was leaving the plunger up once the siphon started. If I leave it down it works. I am not a scientific minded person so I did not get this at first, took trial and error. Instructions on the siphon were not that great so I didn’t understand what I was doing wrong. Duh!

 

[Jovimaple]

Ok I figured out it is user error with the auto siphon. I did order a new one with the clamp. First one I received was cracked so returned for replacement. Tried my old mini on today using the clamp. My error was that I was leaving the plunger up once the siphon started. If I leave it down it works. I am not a scientific minded person so I did not get this at first, took trial and error. Instructions on the siphon were not that great so I didn’t understand what I was doing wrong. Duh!

Glad you figured it out! I used mine a lot until I got my AIO. Then for about a year, I bottled directly from the carboy, trying to avoid sucking up any lees at bottling time. At some point I changed my protocol again so that I use my auto-siphon to rack the wine to a sanitized fermenting bucket, into which I add some kmeta so it gets mixed in thoroughly during the racking process. Then I use my AIO to bottle from the bucket. It's easier for me to avoid the lees at bottling time that way!