Finer Wine Kit Finer Wine Kits

[winemaker81]

I have made '2nd wine' (red, from cab or barbera grapes) on 3-4 occasions. It has turned out rather 'thin' both in color and body/mouth feel, and most ppl didn't like it. About the only use I found for it is Sangria
I am thinking that given a good quality kit, + the used skins, would add some complexity to the final product. At this point, perhaps an exercise to be done in the fall.

With 2nd runs, the amount the pomace is pressed directly affects the outcome. The more you press the first run, the less you leave for the 2nd.

The rule I use is for each 2 gallons of 1st run, add 1 gallon water + additives. Next time I'm going to do a 4:1 ratio. I'm also considering buying a couple of low end kits, reconstitute them, and add the pomace from 16 lugs of grapes.

 

[G259]

Hi all. I've made 4 Forte reds so far. All of them appeared to bottom out with a SG of 1.000. Even after 4 weeks of EM, it measured the same. The Merlot was the lowest at 0.998. RJS and WE kits always ended up around 0.992. Do others see the same? Does this mean they will have a little residual sugar?

FWIW, I measured the SG of commercial win

 

[G259]

. . . e (sorry), and they came out comparable. Backsweetening may skew this, but my end results were 1.000 to .995, I think Reiseling (Kabinette) may have been a bit higher. Pinot G came out as 1.002, and Chardonnay - 1.000 even. I'll imagine that it will vary with producer, but a telling experiment (I can't remember some of it . . . !)

 

[Brant]

So my FWK Forte Petite Syrah started at 1.090 SG. By day 4 it was at 1.010 and that is when I quit punching down. It ended at 0.996 on day 15. I was expecting the SG to be lower. I assume this is OK. The instructions did not specify a ending target.

Edit... seems like higher ending SG is normal for the FWK kits. I was a little concerned but I just noticed that a lot of people are having their batches end well above .995. I did taste it and it was definitely dry. I wasn't concerned about not fully fermenting. I actually figured it might be from the skins.

 

[GregT]

. . . e (sorry), and they came out comparable. Backsweetening may skew this, but my end results were 1.000 to .995, I think Reiseling (Kabinette) may have been a bit higher. Pinot G came out as 1.002, and Chardonnay - 1.000 even. I'll imagine that it will vary with producer, but a telling experiment (I can't remember some of it . . . !)

Thanks for the info. I should experiment with the SG of commercial wines that I consider 'dry'.

 

[Boatboy24]

So my FWK Forte Petite Syrah started at 1.090 SG. By day 4 it was at 1.010 and that is when I quit punching down. It ended at 0.996 on day 15. I was expecting the SG to be lower. I assume this is OK. The instructions did not specify a ending target.

Edit... seems like higher ending SG is normal for the FWK kits. I was a little concerned but I just noticed that a lot of people are having their batches end well above .995. I did taste it and it was definitely dry. I wasn't concerned about not fully fermenting. I actually figured it might be from the skins.

Nothing wrong at all with 0.996. Dry is technically anything below 1.000.

 

[winemaker81]

Nothing wrong at all with 0.996. Dry is technically anything below 1.000.

I've had normal wines quit at 1.002 for no reason I could determine.

SG is an overall reading, a result of the water, the alcohol, and everything else in the wine. As mentioned previously, I have a pair of triple Forte kits, which stopped at 0.999 and 0.998, respectively. I suspect that that the Forte kits have enough particles in them that push the SG up in some cases.

 

[Old Corker]

Definitely squeeze the skins afterward. I made a pair of triple batches, and netted about 1.5 liters of wine by pressing the skinpacks.

I’d like to expand on this a bit. I’m still trying to figure out how to manage the FWK skin packs. My last two batches have been double batch Forte kits, so four skin packs in 12 gallons of must. With both I just hand squeezed the bags after 4 weeks. I got about 750ml. Not as much as @winemaker81 is getting by pressing but not too far off. But when I rack off the skins my yield is short of the 12 gallons about 8 liters. I racked to a 6.5 gal and 5 gal car boys and was still 3 liters short. I know I can rack down more but am wondering if there’s a better method to use with the skins. Maybe soak them on distilled water overnight before adding to the must? I get that that’s adding more water than the instructions call for but the beginning SG with the Forte kits is pretty high so what’s the harm?
What are others experience with volume lost to the dry skins.

 

[winemaker81]

Maybe soak them on distilled water overnight before adding to the must? I get that that’s adding more water than the instructions call for but the beginning SG with the Forte kits is pretty high so what’s the harm?

I considered the same thing. However, keep in mind it's not just the ABV to consider, it's acid and other constituents. The kit is balanced for reconstitution to 23 liters, so changing that will change your overall balance.

Will this change the balance enough to mess up the wine? IMO, probably not, but it's best to consider this while making changes.

I suggest that you soak the skins in 1 or 2 gallons of water. Remove the skins and use that water as part of what you reconstitute the kit with, so you don't lose whatever leached into the water by soaking.

At the same time, your numbers seem a bit off from what I got, as it seems like your volume loss was higher than mine.

One thing I did was pull the skin bags from the fermenter and hung them into another primary to drain while we racked the wine. The drained wine was added to the main batch, then we pressed the skin bags. Depending on what you did, that may explain the volume difference.

I'll not get out the big press (#40) to do this again. I have a small fruit press that I need to clean up. That one is perfect sized for pressing skin packs.

 

[Old Corker]

I'll not get out the big press (#40) to do this again. I have a small fruit press that I need to clean up. That one is perfect sized for pressing skin packs.

I thought about buying a small press too. Then I thought that if it’s only going to get me another half a liter is it worth the cost or the effort. Then again it might be the best half a liter of stuff in there.

 

[Bmd2k1]

I've only done one FW forte Bordeaux so far...but my volume loss was negligible. I don't press my skins -- they go into 2x stainless dry hopping tubes & are allowed to just drain naturally as part of my racking process post fermentation into bulk aging 20L Speidel. These 20L Speidels actually hold just a whisker over 6gals.

Cheers!

 

[winemaker81]

I thought about buying a small press too. Then I thought that if it’s only going to get me another half a liter is it worth the cost or the effort. Then again it might be the best half a liter of stuff in there.

For me it was a worthwhile experiment, netting half a liter per batch.

If you need a small press, it's worth the effort. Getting out a #40 press that I normally press up to 160 lbs at a time? Not so much.

 

[Kross]

I've only done one FW forte Bordeaux so far...but my volume loss was negligible. I don't press my skins -- they go into 2x stainless dry hopping tubes & are allowed to just drain naturally as part of my racking process post fermentation into bulk aging 20L Speidel. These 20L Speidels actually hold just a whisker over 6gals.

Cheers!

I was considering buying a 20L Speidel and according to the website it is 5.3 gallons.

 

[Bmd2k1]

I was considering buying a 20L Speidel and according to the website it is 5.3 gallons.

That's the direct conversion of 20L. I have 6 of them & they hold a whisker over 6gals...perfect for bulk aging! I ferment in the 30L's which hold bit over 9gals.

 

[Jovimaple]

I bottled my FWK Frutta Blackberry and Strawberry last night. Super deep color and very fruity flavor and nose. These are winners!

Blackberry and same bottle with the light behind it:



Strawberry and same bottle with the light behind it:


I added chocolate extract (cacao nibs soaked in vodka for 3 months) to a gallon of each of these. When I tasted them yesterday, I wanted a stronger chocolate flavor, but today when I have sampled some of the leftovers that I mixed together both the chocolate and plain, it's very good. So I am going to let them age a bit in the bottle and see how they change. I accidentally bought a bunch of 200 ml bottles when I thought I was ordering 375 ml bottles, so I have lots of small samples to try as they age.

Now I just have to figure out where to store all of these bottles!!

 

[She’sgonnakillme]

Just racked two Forte wines, Bordeaux SG 1.092 FG .994 and Cab Sauv SG 1.100 FG .996

 

[ratflinger]

Just started my 1st Forte - Super Tuscan. I've been drinking the FWK I made last year, they are really good.

 

[TCPT18]

I thought about buying a small press too. Then I thought that if it’s only going to get me another half a liter is it worth the cost or the effort. Then again it might be the best half a liter of stuff in there.

I made a small bucket press to manage the skins in these kits. Probably not as good as a fruit press but definately better than by hand. I kept pre press and post press wines separate. I am now trying to decide if I should mix them together before bottling or keep them seperate and bottle separate to see how differant they are taste, body and otherwise.

 

[winemaker81]

I made a small bucket press to manage the skins in these kits. Probably not as good as a fruit press but definately better than by hand. I kept pre press and post press wines separate. I am now trying to decide if I should mix them together before bottling or keep them seperate and bottle separate to see how differant they are taste, body and otherwise.

Pressings typically are heavier and more tannic. From my experience, I'd mix them, but you might bottle 1 each of the main batch and the pressings, to compare against the blend in a year.

 

[three_jeeps]

A bit of guidance/reality check in my process for making FWK Forte Melot...

Day1 - SG=1.032 - Yeast pitched, fermentation bucket lid loosely attached and completely covering bucket
Day7 - SG = 1.005, Lid sealed on bucket, airlock added
Day 15 will be this coming Monday, 3/21 - Instructions say on day 15 rack to carboy. Not clear if I should follow the directions by the day and rack OR wait another 7 days and rack (which would be 15 days from when I sealed the fermentation bucket. Any harm in waiting an additional 7 days and rack on Monday 3/28?
I understand that EM is happening and a CO layer is forming between surface of the must and the lid - I just want to make sure that I don't rush the process.
Thanks for any advice....
J