Roasted Almond Wine.. It's your goy's fault!

[Rice_Guy]

. Bonus. Pecans have a pretty good shelf life once shelled, which is better in the fridge, but they should easily make it through a fermentation process if fresh.
We will need to do our best to ultimately remove the oils and protect from oxygen. Pecan oil doesn’t solidify like other oils when cooled, so it will probably take soaking it up and several rackings to get as much out as possible..

What flavor do you want? For me eating pecans off the tree in the back yard was clean/ fresh where as with a month storage they have oxidized oils/ store typical US flavor. ,,, ie the difference between boiled peanuts and roaster peanuts, ,, To produce “normal” flavors they need some oxidation.
Oxidation rate will not substantially change at 40F, what will increase the oxidation is to lower the humidity (water activity) so that free radicals propagate reactions. Back to boiled peanuts they have been heated to 250F without the oil degradation/ taste change. Commercially we do nitrogen flushing to remove oxygen. Practically speaking at home -24inches Hg with a head space eliminator or a vacuum pack with a barrier film would be more efficient.

Practically speaking an oil sheen means that there was a technique to remove the oil from the seed (ex. 5K pressure or hexane washing). The oils are happy staying in the cell organelles where they were deposited. Yes there will be some solubilization in water in the range of mg/liter. 12% alcohol is a better solvent so post ferment you will be in the range of 100 mg/liter. The small percentage of oils solubilized will be most of the nut like flavor. Sugars in a roasted nut can give you caramelized flavors.
An oil sheen will float on water. Commercially there are rope like scrapers that collect fats at meat plants, your concept is good.

 

[David Violante]

What flavor do you want? For me eating pecans off the tree in the back yard was clean/ fresh where as with a month storage they have oxidized oils/ store typical US flavor.

At first I was looking for a roasted pecan flavor, with some of the caramelization that happens with roasting. After having begun, and with the raisins added, it seems like more of a pecan pie kind of flavor. I'm happy with the change in that I know where the 'pie' component comes from (raisins). I have not had the opportunity to eat fresh pecans. I will have to add that to my bucket list! That said, I'm very comfortable with where it is in regards to flavor. I might do another one sans raisins and post this experience to see if I can hone in on simply a pecan flavor.

The oils are happy staying in the cell organelles where they were deposited. Yes there will be some solubilization in water in the range of mg/liter. 12% alcohol is a better solvent so post ferment you will be in the range of 100 mg/liter. The small percentage of oils solubilized will be most of the nut like flavor. An oil sheen will float on water. Commercially there are rope like scrapers that collect fats at meat plants, your concept is good.

So it looks like post-fermentation, soaking up the oils that float, racking off the oils, and sulfiting as a normal course of action will help to reduce any rancidity in those that remain in solution. (And also that at the beginning it's a good idea to roast and then boil)

 

[BigDaveK]

Like they say, if there's no picture then it didn't happen. So, my hazelnut...



I'm amazed and happy how much flavor was extracted with a bit of simmering.

When the time comes - and assuming success - I think back sweetening with a little brown sugar might be just the thing for nuts.

 

[Rice_Guy]

FYI ,,An interesting nut like flavor is ube, as from the Philippines (purple yam),

 

[joeswine]

Thank you everyone! This is what I love about this forum! So after quite some time of researching, based on everyone’s input, here are some more things I came up with. Please correct me if anything seems amiss.

Pecans have mostly unsaturated fats, which is why they are more prone to Oxidative Rancidity than Hydrolytic ones. Plus, heating them by toasting helps to destroy the enzymes necessary for a Hydrolytic reaction. Bonus. Pecans have a pretty good shelf life once shelled, which is better in the fridge, but they should easily make it through a fermentation process if fresh.

We will need to do our best to ultimately remove the oils and protect from oxygen. Pecan oil doesn’t solidify like other oils when cooled, so it will probably take soaking it up and several rackings to get as much out as possible.

Another bonus, making candied pecans from the pomace. It seems as though folks previously tried making cookies with them but since the raisins and pecans were fermented, the cookies tasted more like little fruitcakes. Unless that’s your thing of course.

There are a couple of threads here about Pecan Wine dating back a few years, this one was the most informative.

@winemanden I did look into some of the liqueurs, and it depends on how they are made: soaking nuts in a high proof alcohol for some time and distilling seem to be the most common methods.

Buying extraction is a much simpler process

 

[joeswine]

Buying extraction is a much simpler process

And you can control the flavor as well as the abv, just sayin

 

[David Violante]

Yes, true, but then I wouldn’t have learned so much about all this, and now have some additional experience in the toolbox too. I am interested in trying an extract, and still might, but wanted to try this route first. Thank you for the suggestion a few pages ago~

 

[winemaker81]

Buying extraction is a much simpler process

This is true, and in many cases it's a fine solution. [I have used them in beer making]

However, as @David Violante says, there is great value in experimentation. I have learned much through direct experimentation, as well as from the efforts of others.

I have no interest in making almond wine, but follow threads like this one because of curiosity. Something I learn may be of benefit in one of my projects. Or it may not. Either way it's fun.

 

[joeswine]

I agree full about experimenting if you follow me you all know that it’s my thing I always experiment.
Sometimes , just sometimes it’s better to follow the advice you ask for and after that end you can see what you might have done differently than your learning.
It’s just my babble , thoughts , ideas nothing more

 

[David Violante]

Love it~ thank you! That’s what this forum is all about.

 

[BigDaveK]

@vinny and @David Violante any nut wine update?

I'm at 1.032 from1.092 four days after pitching. Tastes wonderful!! Hazelnut flavor definitely identifiable. No visible signs of oil but I can feel it on the hydrometer and turkey baster, very slippery. Cleans easily with just a tiny bit of Dawn, plain hot water didn't quite get the job done. I expect visible evidence of oil once transferred to secondary.

I know it's early but right now I really want to explore more nut wines next year.

 

[David Violante]

Here’s a few pics of where it is today~ down to 1.010, getting ready to rack it to secondary. You can see some oil sheen on the equipment, I imagine it will come clean as you recommended Dave. The color is nice, I’m looking forward to what it looks like cleared. Also, a picture of the nuts on top, wine, and lees. Tastes…amazing…!

 

[BigDaveK]

Here’s a few pics of where it is today~ down to 1.010, getting ready to rack it to secondary. You can see some oil sheen on the equipment, I imagine it will come clean as you recommended Dave. The color is nice, I’m looking forward to what it looks like cleared. Also, a picture of the nuts on top, wine, and lees. Tastes…amazing…!View attachment 96989 View attachment 96990 View attachment 96991

Fantastic!
I can't wait till next October for my nuts so I'll probably get something on my next Costco trip.
I think one takeaway from this is to definitely ignore the 2 oz/1 cup recommendation in recipes. Gee, what a surprise...

 

[Raptor99]

I'm following this thread. I have some "wild" hazelnut trees on my property, probably seeded by nature from nearby hazelnut farms. This year if I can get some hazelnuts before the squirrels eat them all I want to try this.

 

[joeswine]

Good here’s a thought, fill a ball jar with just the nuts ( no shells ) then fill the jar with Everkleer put the lip on tight weight a month you should have a perfect extract to use , no fuss no muss

 

[David Violante]

Good here’s a thought, fill a ball jar with just the nuts ( no shells ) then fill the jar with Everkleer put the lip on tight weight a month you should have a perfect extract to use , no fuss no muss

I'm trying this one next. So, what kind of base do you start with then? Just a plain sugar wine with some bananas for body and then add the extract after primary fermentation?

 

[vinny]

@vinny and @David Violante any nut wine update?

I'm at 1.032 from1.092 four days after pitching. Tastes wonderful!! Hazelnut flavor definitely identifiable. No visible signs of oil but I can feel it on the hydrometer and turkey baster, very slippery. Cleans easily with just a tiny bit of Dawn, plain hot water didn't quite get the job done. I expect visible evidence of oil once transferred to secondary.

I know it's early but right now I really want to explore more nut wines next year.

I don't have much to add, I am in the sit and wait stage. I had a taste not too long ago and I like the almond flavor, it is definitely present. I may need to adjust acidity. it is not very tart, but I don't know if that is good or not. Maybe back sweetening will be the golden ticket.

I'm not even at 2 months yet. There isn't much to it so I'm guessing it will be an early drinker. I think I might start fiddling in a few months. We are all walking in the dark here. I don't have anything to compare it to, so I don't even know whether I am on the right track, or not.

It's cleared. Still some oil on top. I have a little more headspace than I like, but what do I top it with? I ended up with a perfect gallon. What wine goes with almonds? Maybe I could water down some vodka to 20% for a topper. I like the idea of the extract. I think that will be next for me, too.

Still looking for hazelnuts.

I am not sure what is on the jug, I knocked a knuckle on it and it didn't move. Might be oil, or CO2 in oil?

 

[David Violante]

Dave your almond wine looks great. I like the color and clarity.

I imagine (Vodka / Everclear) would work as you described for headspace. There's a lot of suggestions about marbles, etc... as long as they don't contain lead. Be careful dropping them in if you go that route. I don't know the effect, even how minute, of glass hitting glass. I think that's been discussed here as well and it's probably not an issue if I remember, but forewarned is forearmed. Air-filled neutral marbles would be amazing. I just made those up. Vodka it is...

Racking mine tonight, it's under airlock right now. I wonder what these pecans would taste like on a nice healthy salad with cranberries...

 

[vinny]

I wonder what these pecans would taste like on a nice healthy salad with cranberries...

Hopefully you will let us know!

 

[vinny]

Dave your almond wine looks great. I like the color and clarity.

Thanks. No clearing agents, just a few weeks and pectic enzyme added in the must.